The Dark Side lures another victim! UPDATE! PICS!

Modeling Subjects Armor
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well boys & girls, it’s happened.
the irresistable pull of treaded thingies has drawn me in!

last night, sometimes by candlelight (power out for a while due to fringe or hurricane passing thru), i began assembly of my first AFV kit. it’s a 1/35 Tamiya PzKpfw IV Ausf D.

i have assembled the 16 road wheels + the two spares, the drive and idler gears, mounted the idler arms and drive gear mounts to the lower hull.
(please excuse any mis-naming of the bits, it’s my first tank!) [:)]

and i have already lost a piece as one of the ‘hub caps’ for a road wheel leapt for freedom and is still at large. [}:)]
i substituted one of the hub pieces from the spare road wheels.
there seemed to be two extra hub caps. unless i am also supposed to put them on the ‘back’ of the spare wheels. then i’m still one short. [:)]

i also assembled the muffler, but did not add the smoke grenade piece as i feared it would not paint properly w/ that on.

which leads me to a question (first in a series, i bet!) [:D]

should i put the rear plate on the lower hull w/o attaching muffler, etc ? i think that the muffler would go on after the hull is painted, but i don’t know.

is there a standard list of stuff that you leave off until after painting? (aside from tools, jerry cans, cable, etc)

i plan to paint the road wheels and drive & idler gears off the hull and put them on after the hull is painted. and i figure the turret should be painted off the hull, but are there other pieces i should watch out for?

i am mainly watching for stuff that will create an unpaintable ‘shadow’ for the airbrush.

any advice or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

thanks,
ed.

2

William,

When I paint or do a camo scheme, I leave off most of the tools and accessories (cable, jacks, etc) I assemble the piece as completely as I can before painting. This means mufflers too.
Just visualize what the actual crew would have painted in the field. For the base coat or main color, I paint the turret off the tank, so I can get the bottom. When it comes time for the camoflage to be applied, it goes on the tank itself. This way, it looks even.

Remember, most German armor came from the factory in either German Panzer Grey or Dark Yellow. For exhausts, you can pretty much leave it alone with the base color and paint them to show wear (rust, dirty exhaust and such)

As for the road wheels, I paint them seperate, so I can get all sides covered (and weathered) then add them to the model.

3

Eric,
thanks!
it makes sense, but i was afraid that i would not be able to get paint ‘behind’ the muffler and bare plastic would show.

there is still a LOT of assembly left. man, these kits have a lot of pieces!
i have turned nearly 100 pieces into about 2 dozen, and i am not completed steps 1,2 & 3 !!
but i am enjoying it so far.
ed.

4

I hear ya’

In most tracked vehicle kits, the roadwheel assembly is usually the first and the most time consuming. UNLESS, you happen to have a kit with seperate track links (talk about spending some quality time at the model bench)

5

Welcome to the dark side wildwilliam!!! It sounds like you’ve got the general idea on the build process. It also come down to personal preference. Some people will put every last piece on the kit before they even start painting. I pretty much go along with Erock as for my preferences, basically I assemble everything I can and still get a good paint job. I did attach most of the extra stuff on my Marder before I started weathering to give it an even apperence but I left off the rear basket and a few other items that would get in the way. Have fun with it and post us some progress pics [:D]

Eric

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Good to see you’re not trying to resist the lure of the darkside any longer Ed.

I see my brother Eric and my other brother Eric have taken good care of you here.

There is no right way, just the way you feel most comfortable with.
Myself, everything that can go on, does go on and gets painted with the base coat. Details I pick out later including tools, mufflers, etc.

7

Sherm - back from your joyride in the German armor? [:D]
how’s it handle compared to your usual ride?
i know i have to be careful, because i had a devil of a time painting around the fixed gear on a 1/32 Stuka. i really wished i had left it off until after! At least i had the good sense to leave the bracing for the horizontal stab off. [:)]

Erush-
not sure how i will do for pics. the only digital camera i can get my hands on (from work) does not shoot close ups very well.
i have used to to take some pictures of some winged models to keep my buddy posted, but it will not shoot good tight shots.
which is flattering for my work, because it should not be looked at too closely!![:0]

Erock -
didn’t the hot exhaust burn the paint off the mufflers?

All -
my kit has rubber road wheels.
do you paint them grey and then mask to airbrush the rubber,
or paint it by hand or what?
i am not thrilled with the thought of making 32 round masks, but i will do it if that’s the way to go.

thanks!
ed.

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gotcha!!!
another one for the dark side…
about the road wheel thing, don’t mask the wheels… use an artist’s circle template (about $5 at Staples or most office supply places) to mask the tires and spray or airbrush ur road wheels.
for the lost piece, try shining a flashlight parallel to the floor(actually right on the floor) and the piece will cast a shadow. i lost a road wheel on one of my afv projects last nite, and it took me almost 30 minutes of looking… but i found it in the end !
hth,
frosty[:)]

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Frosty,
so i paint the whole thing black and then hold the nearest sized circle over the wheel and it masks the tire for me?
boy, (or girl, in this case[:)] ), do i feel dumb!
i believe i have a artist’s circle template (thin plastic w/ a bunch of round holes in it?) [:o)]
wish i had asked abt this before i cut masks for my 1/48 Hamp!
live & learn.

what keeps the paint from bleeding in?
i guess keep the airbrush perpendicular to the mask?

for the missing ‘hub cap’ i already pirated a piece. not sure if the lost one fell in the radiator vanes by the hot water pipes along the floor or what. i figured it would turn up as soon as i glued something else in it’s place.

if i can find my template, can start painting wheels.
but i guess i have to paint the tires first!
thanks!
ed.

10

Nothing like the lure of the good ol’ tracked vehicles of the past present and the well, the soon to be?
Gotta love it!

Welcome!

That kit is a good build, I’ve three of them and they both went together very well
I painted mine dark yellow and pretty much have them looking like a showroom desplay ( for now anyway ). They’re part of my large Dio plan with a few tigers and some other goodies with a german convoy trying to get back to the reich through the Brenner pass only to get caught up in a pass by some GI’s on a hill and two US spitfires to shoot them up.
I just have to wait till I ETS out of the army to finnish it, due to it possibly getting destroyed in the move stateside.

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Redleg,
are those M109A6s on the ‘previous’ link Marder variants? [:)]

am thinking of doing mine in the basic grey from the campaign in Poland or France.
but those Afrika Corps schemes are attractive too.
i’d better buy another one! [:D]
uh-oh looks like the bug has bit!
ed.

12

Once you go track you’ll never go back WW.

I paint in assemblies. Turret, hull, wheels. A good airbrushing will get most of those areas that you might think would not. I use a stand with a lazy susan so I can spin the work as I paint it. It elevates it so I can get at it from different angles. This allows me to cover everything and see everything. Sometimes the turret will not fit after painting. This is because the layers of primer, paint, camo, etc. have removed any tolerance or “play”. This is easily scraped away with a knife and will allow you to seat the turret.

Once done I put on my details like pioneer gear, cables, extra equipment etc. Sometimes this gear was painted the same color as the vehicle so do your research. Do not automaticly assume that all shovel or pick handles are brown or light tan. They are sometimes painted the same color as the vehicles base color. If the camo was quickly applied in the field, they may have been left in place when the vehicle was painted. If you have painted the vehicle and need to add parts after the fact, see where the parts contact and scrape the paint at the contact points so you get a plastic to plastic join. (some glues will attack the paint so they will not make a secure bond or in most cases the bond will only be as strong as the layer of paint).

Some parts will need to be painted prior to assembly. This is dependent on if your vehicle is buttoned up or how much detail you want to add into the build.

Wheels are the monotonous bane of every modeler I think. I put each wheel on a stick and then stick that into a length of styrofoam. Spray paint one side then the other. After they are dry, I go in by hand and paint the road wheel tires. This is done with a fine brush and is done as careful as possible without touching the rim (this actually seems tedious and is. But it will pass the time more quickly and be easier if the paint is fluid eough to flow but not thin enough to be transparent.). I tighten up the line of contact between the rim and tire by using a thick wash of black oil paint. Because I use acrylics, the thinner doesn’t react with the acrylic and will capillary around the edge of the rim. Because it is a wash, it will do all the cool things washed are used for like collect along edges and in corners. Much like the edge created by rim and tire. If thick enough it will cover any “gap” and make for a nice clean line. Surface tension does the rest and when it dries it will look crisp. Any imperfection in the tonal value at that point will be hidden by any road weathering or the eye will assimilate the whole picture and will not register the imperfection becuase of the “visual noise” of the wheel as well as its size. I have used Frosty’s suggestion of the circle template and either a US standard of measurement or a metric will give you any size you need to acurately mask the wheel. It is dependent on your own preference but both work well. Do yourself a favor though and clean the surface of the template after every use. Paint build up will render useless the tight edges and will make it harder to get a good seat. Remeber though, if the template is thicker than the rim edge you will have tire color on the edge of your rim. If you plan on showing and getting into the judging this could bounce you out of a dead heat. (Merely a consideration if you ever decide to go this route. It seems nit pickey but at the level that some guys build and show to, a necessary consideration when it comes to judging).

Weathering is optional. Some like to build show room or factory fresh vehicles. Noting wrong with it. In fact sometimes its harder to build to that level than it is to weather. But if you are going to weather, do it after assembly and as the last project before display.

Good luck

Mike

13

Yes,

That’s why it doesn’t really matter if you leave them on. I usually give the exhausts a coat of Flat Black, then drybrush with a tad of Rust (Over the base color)

14

Welcome Wildwilliam to the dark side. [}:)] You must now answer to Lord Shermanfreak and all his disciples. [}:)][}:)] MMoowwaahaaahaaaa…

“It is well that war is so terrible, lest we grow too fond of it.”-R.E.Lee

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Mike - THANKS! i appreciate the info and effort it takes to type it up. i am getting ready to head back to the bench to get some work in tonight.
i have been checking out some armor sites looking at pics, and i think i will look for some books. but i don’t think i am ready to pop for any of the heavy duty books just yet. the prices of some of them give me reason to pause! [:0]
but i can certainly afford the “In Action” for the Pzkpfw IV at least.
if any of you have any recommendations for good (German for now, sorry, Sherm!) armor reference books that cost less than the kit, please give me some leads. i know from scanning at greatmodels.com that there is no shortage of titles, but i don’t know which ones are worth the $$
i don’t think there will be any contests in my (near) future. and i will stick to OOB to start. there’s plenty in this box to keep me busy & challenged!
thanks again!
ed.

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Not quite sure what your looking for in a reference book. I have many of the In Action books by Squadron, they are quite handy. The Osprey Military New Vanguard books are similar in style, but go deeper on certain information such as development and deployment. They do cost a little bit more. Both are worth the price. Though I don’t have any of the Schiffer books, they are cheap and cover a vast array of armor. Good luck.

“It is well that war is so terrible, lest we grow too fond of it.”-R.E.Lee

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Tigerman - i guess something w/ decent reference photos or drawings.
and some kind of color guide for camo patterns & such.
Renarts got me wondering when he was telling me to check & see how
the external eqpt was painted.

the history interest me, but i am not looking for a book that ‘does it all’
i am not adverse to adding to my book collection (which fills my apt and a small
storage area!!) i just don’t want to end up saying:
“i can’t believe i spent $x on this worthless book”

i have a few “in Action” for planes, so i know they are pretty good.
and i have a few of the “Walkaround” books and think they are better.
also in the plane world there are ‘Detail & Scale’ (very good)
just wondering what the pecking order for armor references was.

i really appreciate all you guys helping me out.
ed.

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There is a series of publications called Allied & Axis. They are pictorial books of equipment and pretty comprehensive for what they cover. I’ve seen them for as low as $5.95 and as high as $15.95 depending on where you get them from. Pictoral wise I would say they are some of the best I’ve seen for resource material on variants and “in use” vehicles. The Squadron books on Panzer colors are worth the money I think.

As for getting skunked on books, it happens. I’m with you, I don’t mind shelling out hard earned money on books that I can use and reference as well as glean information from but there is a limit. Although I think it comes down to how much is a particular piece of information or reference worth to you. I’ve spent a hefty sum of money on books that I was only interested in a few pages and a reference pic or two, but the information was well worth the expenditure because it was the only resource available.
The grail of books for US armor are the Hunnicutt books I guess. They are priced from $200-$700. But they are supposed to be the books to have for US armor. I have some bookseller friends of mine trying to run me down a copy or two of the Sherman Book. (They look at it as some sort of sport hunt to find these books at the lowest possible price. They got me a medieval book that was going for $200 for less than $80) Since I’m pretty much a book whore I will always look for good reference books.

Mike

19

Renarts -
gee, i thought the technical term was bibliophile ! [:)]
i know what you mean. i work two blocks from a used book store and i am in there 3 to 5 days a week it seems.
my book backlog puts my kit stockpile to shame!!
thanks for the leads, i will keep an eye out on line and on foot for some armor references.
i glued some more pieces together tonight. the hull is starting to look like something. still plenty more to go before i have to pick a paint scheme.

ed.

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wildwilliam,
You mean the one I built or the real one in my section?