No builds this weekend as I got roped into doing the overtime Saturday shift yesterday and today…today I went to a fairly decent size Model show which just happened to be 20 minutes from my house!
Managed to pick up a good haul; Tamiya extra thin cement & Mr surfacer 500 (both of which I’ve been after for a while but whenever I’ve found a place on the web that sells them they always seem to be sold out-especially the Mr Surfacer), some Vallejo paints, a selection of nice 000 brushes to aid with my figure painting some pre-blackened small scale chain and finally the kit of one of my favourite 'Nam era pieces of armour, the Academy ‘Ontos’. I picked her up for a very decent price as I got to the show for the last hour when a lot of kit is reduced.
I’ve always loved this piece, it just looks awesome and is always a real head turner! I was planning to make a start on my Dragon Panther G that I have in my stash on completion of my current halftrack WIP but I just think I might build this one next [H]
I’ve just spent the last hour looking at photos of the real thing and other models. The one variant seems to be the colour of the actual barrels? Should they be Olive green or much darker-like a gun metal colour?
Looking at the bulk of the photos I’m pretty sure they should be green like the rest of the body but I thought I’d check.
Perhaps a few of you guys have actually been aboard one of these things-any pointers? I’d love to find a good build log to follow but the only one I’ve found seems to be incomplete and all te photos are now missing from the thread! Have any of you guys built this kit?
Many thanks chaps-have a great week and hopefully I’ll be able to get stuck into my halftrack next weekend too!
This is going from memory, and its been over forty years since I saw these beasts in the streets of Hue.
IIRC, the entire vehicle was painted Marine Corps field green (not OD, as stated in Academy’s directions) with yellow serials. The 106mm rifles were usually dark gray parkerized, but occasionally that weird green shade peculiar to Saco weapons. The operating levers may have been painted, and I never saw any with brass knobs as shown in the Squadron Ontos book.
I can’t say that I ever saw an M40 recoilless rifle itself painted, though the tripod usually was.
The receivers of the M8 spotting rifles were more of a zinc anodized gold tone with dark gray parkerized barrels.
Ben - They are NOT green…they are parkerized. I will be starting my WIP blog of the Ontos next week. I have a bunch of research material for this build.
Get me an e-mail via PM, I have some photos including a close up of the barrel and spotting rifle courtesy of Steve Zaloga.
As stated above, the color was Marine Corp Green but many times the only touch up paint in VN was OD…so you could have some “dark” spots in places
Redleg-I don’t know off the top of my head exactly what ‘Parkerized’ means but I have a good idea!
Perfect timing-I’ve got my WIP Halftrack on the bench at present but I’d be honoured to be able to look over your shoulder as I’ll be starting this build in about 3 weeks!
Great stuff-do you have this very same kit Redleg?
Kind regards and many thanks for the heads up on the soon to be WIP! Looks like I’ll be joining you!
It’s an acid treatment to metal if memory serves… I do know it comes out as kind of a grayish green with a rough texture from my experience with a parkerized 1911 pistol.
I’ve been doing some research on these things, and have found some interesting things.
They used two different barrels on them, and have been known to be intermixed
There is at least two different hull designs and maybe even a third!
I’ve found two different tracks in use on them
I made measurments on a track a few weeks back, and found some interesting things. The track I measured was driven in place and still has the engine and transmission installed in it.
looking at the fenders you will see an angled corner at both ends just above the front and back road wheels. I found that there was about one inch of slant to the rear. Then there was the bar that holds all the road wheels together. Measuring from the centerline of the front and back roadwheels I saw 12.75" and 17.25". My notes say the slat is forward, but that just dosn’t sound right at the moment. I’ll get back down there in the next few days to reafirm the measurements.
So what I’m saying is that you need to see a few photos of the track your doing as there is a difference in the fuel and oil covers and at least one hatch. The barrels are either bell mouthed, or have a completely different front end with a recessed rifeling. Also there maybe (maybe not) a difference between the upper barrels and the two bottom barrels. If I was still gainfully employed I could find out all the data as it was still on the fish scale.
Parerizing usually comes out a dark battleship grey in color that has a frosty like finish. I have seen it come out as a charcoal grey as well. A lighter grey color usually signifies that the metal has been nitride hardened.
Looking at the build guide it’s obvious that the ONTOS will build into two distinct parts-hull and turret with the barrels. Is is just the actual BARRELS that are parkerised? Will the rest of the turret be Olive green like the hull?
Charcoal grey eh? are we looking at a darker grey than say, Panzer Grey? Any XF number suggestions?
Redleg: Indeed you’ll be starting before me as this halftrack is going to take another few weeks yet. Your BLOG will help no end. Are you an acrylic or enamel guy? I’m thinking of breaking out the enamels for this one just for a change.
Ben, virtually all modern U.S. military firearms from WW2 on were parkerized (the exception being the AR class which are aluminum but wear a anodized coating similar to parkerizing). Google color pictures of “M1 Carbine”, “M1 Garand” or such and you should get an idea what color parkerizing is. Basically yes it is darker than Panzer Grey. I just use Tamiya “Gunmetal”. Works just fine.
Next, with the exception of metallic finishes (Alclad lacquer) I only use acrylic. I got rid of all the enamels off my shelf.
Parkerized…no set color rather a mix of a couple of colors (Redleg soup)…all in good time!!
The first installment will be this weekend…
Gary -
Good stuff but I will give you the big one…Academey screwed up the suspension and road wheel placement. When the model is done…it looks like an Ontos. For a “scale” recreation…well we will have to wait for the next rendition.
And no…it cannot be fixed without MAJOR surgery!!
As far as differences…3 vehicles 3 weeks in the field and they are all a little different…but I know what you are saying, just by looking at all the pics.
I’ve looked over two of them up close, and have several photos of others in Vietnam and also being used for a display. The one down the road from me has silver barrels as well as the barrel mounts. But the other had the barrels painted Marine green. The ones I have photos of also are green. The casting that the barrels are mounted on are silver on the one close by, but the actual rotating part that fits into the hull is green.
It was the history of the Vietnam conflict that first turned me onto WWII hobby history when I was about 12-with armour being my newest interest I’m still learning a hell of a lot-especially with the modelling to go with it now!
I just had to get myself a 'Nam build and when I first saw the Academy ONTOS I knew I had to had to have one. Having seen these thing in books etc I just thought that you couldn’t imagine anything so crazy!
I’ve only got Tamiya & Dragon kits on my shelf and have very little experience of Academy - do they have a good rep? The kit itself looks spot on. Good build guide, decent tracks and well moulded plastic. I see that Academy are a South Korean firm so they should be good.
As I’ve said before I’ve got a few weeks to go on this little Halftrack I’m building so hopefully Redlegs WIP will be up & running to give me a hand!
Btw, I visited an old friend who used to be a history buff and he had two volumes, in binders, of magazines called “'Nam”. He said he didn’t want them any more and said I could have the lot for £10 so of the magazine and two 'Nam binders for them all. Have you guys ever come across these-the spelling is in the American type ie ‘color’? They are a superb read.
That Nam set sounds like one i collected years ago. After you finished the mags there was 10 thicker books to go with it. Mine is around the house somwhere.
Not sure about Academy armour kits, i have stcuk with the tamiya or Dragon equavalant, such as the wirbelwind and stuG IV, but there aircraft kits that i have come across are very nice. There Me 262 is deffinatly better than the Hasagawa one, so if that is anything to go by you should be ok.
I was around two 106 recoiless rifles in my tour, and the barrels were parkerized just like an M16 was. A dark grey color. One was parked about a hundred fifty feet from my back door, and had to walk around it to get to the four holer (not a lot of fun to bump into in the middle of the night). To take this a step further everything on the barrel assembly was parkerized including the breech handle
As for the suspension problems, that’s why I was trying to make some reasonably accurate measurments. The track I measured is setting on a concrete pad. I know for a fact that the drive train is complete, but sans any ammunition and the top mounted fifty cal spotting rifles as well as the center M2 machinegun. What I’m going todo next is to see if there is a serial number on the outside (all the doors are tack welded shut), and then try to find out when it was built.
The drive train is very simple in design, and assuming that Academy got the pieces at least close to being correct, built a new hull bottom half. I plan on doing it in CAD first, and then work off CAD drawings. Yet as I’ve said before I see at least two different hulls on the top side, and maybe a third. Nothing too hard todo here, but changing the locations of one hatch and fuel and oil filling locations The track on the one closest to me is much different than the one at FT Knox. Yet like the other one is still a sheet metal stamping mounted on a rubber band. Both have the rubber pad in the center of the cleat (4.5" wide), but look different. The front drive sprocket has a metal center with green rubber drive teeth
The barrels are a completely different story! There are two different muzzels on the one close by. One has a slight bell shape on the end while the others have a band on the front (.62" x 4.62 in diameter) with a counter bore at that end that’s about .50" deep. The bell shaped one did not have the counter bore in the I.D. Yet I may have found another with strait barrels! The one at Knox has the bell shaped barrels if I remember correctly.
Tthe entire 106 was parkerized. It started off as a real dark gray, almost black, just like a rifle and faded to a medium dark gray (think panzer gray) with a hint of green.
Silverback nailed it with the anodized spotting rifle though. As I remember it, they started life a gray brown color which rapidly changed. The mags for the .50 cal rounds were gray for sure.
I don’t recall muzzle types but then again I never paid much attention to them.
Hummm…we are going parkerized crazy so here (courtesy of Steve Zaloga) is the 106 with 50 cal rifle colors
As you can see the “parkerized” is a silver-gray with a hint of green (hint…mix 3 colors).
The 50 Cal’s are a mix of polished and brushed aluminum with a steel mag.
Hope this some what settles things. Most of what you see on display…they paint everything since it is now static but when operational it should look like this.
I never paid much attention to any 106 till I got to doing some research on them. The ones I was around didn’t use mags for the fifty, and you loaded each round one at a time
