I know it was red, but what kind of red?
I want to stick with Model Master enamels.
It looks more like signal red as opposed to Insignia.
Any ideas?
It was described by Commonwealth troops as “vermillion”. I think Signal Red will work.
Also, the aircraft was reportedly all red, except the national insignia.
G
Which Dr 1? MvR flew several, and none were all red… The one he died in, FOK Dr1 425/17, was painted in several colors, but predominantly a Vermiilion Red… I agree with you that Signal Red is too “red”…
FOK Dr1 425/17
Upper surfaces, red
Cowl, Aluminum
Light Blue undersides
White rudder
Light blue wheel covers
New, straight-sided insinia with old style visible under it…
As very! As “Flying Circus”! As is your face! Vermillion !!!
HvH is certainly correct to ask which Dr I. The League of WWI Aero Historians’ publication Over the Front, printed a fairly comprehensive article on all MvR’s aircraft in Vol 3, No 3, Autumn 1988, by Dan-San Abbott. It provides information on nearly all the planes MvR flew, from the Albatros D II through Dr I 425/17 in which he died.
Mr. Abbott’s conclusion is the MvR flew at least a couple that were all red: 477/17 and 425/17. Others, like 152/17, carried red on the top wing, the tailplane, the fuselage sides from just ahead of the “Iron Cross” to the tail, the engine cowling, wing struts (both interplane and cabane) and wheel hubs.
Dr I 127/17 was described by MvR himself in his combat report for victories 68 and 76, as having red on the “upper deck, cowling, wheels and tail.”
MvR’s original triplane, actually F. I 102/17, is believed never to have carried any red at all.
What this means is that you can build lots of triplanes representing the Baron–and they won’t all look the same.
Hals und Beinbruch!
Please disregard the aluminum cowl stuff. That comes from a 5th generation image of 101/17 in flight. Not 425/17. for all things Dr.I see
The red is described as “Indian lake” in the Methuen reference. Mix Testors insignia red with Testors brown 1166, 8 - 2 ratio. By the way 425/17 was painted for MvR at the factory as a “gift” by order of A. Fokker hisself.
w/n 2009, Fok. Dr.I 425/17 was flown during April 1918 by Rittmeister Manfred von Richthofen commander of JG.I. This is a DML kit with modified decals from the 5903 kit.
Thanks. I’ll give it a shot. 5:2 Insignia Red to Flat Military Brown 1166T.
I figured there were many shades and colors. I’m going for the 425/17 of Jasta 11 red with white tail look as shown on the cover of the Revell box art, and by your pictures.
I concurr, based on further research this afternoon… Sorry about that…
Regarding the colorized photo though:
Chris Watson writes:
I tend to agree with Mr. Imrie regarding the blemish in the B&W version of the photo… Further research has also uncovered the fact that the Tripe was all-red with a white rudder) at the time the Baron was shot down, but had, at least one time prior to that, been photographed with the light blue undersides…
So basically, I’m now saying that FOK Dr1 425/17 was all-red (whether it was Vemillion red or Indian Lake red isn’t the issue right now), with the exception of the struts (that’s another issue from what I’m reading) and the rudder (which appears to have been painted white) on 21 APR 18…
At some point prior to that date, the undersides were indeed, light blue blue… This makes sense if one takes into account that the aircraft, due to operational requirements, was likely painted over a period of several days, if not several weeks, and not brought into the hangar and done up in one evening…
Now, regarding “Vermillion Red” vs Indian Lake Red"… My other source show the following:
The top and side surface show that there was no “Fokker camouflage streaking” under the red paint. the red as been identified as:
Methuen 10F8 DIAMINE BROWN (Dan-San Abbott) with carbon black added.
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Now that all that is said is said and done, I personally go with the TLAR Method… “That Looks About Right”…
Weta workshop boys did this. I imagine they would have done exhaustive research into it too.
Oh man, if only I had the space for 1/1 dioramas…
This is Dr. I 425/17 about April 15 -16, 1918.
Verified images of Fok. Dr.I 425/17 after delivery from the Fokker Factory.
Please pardon my trifocals that is 8 to 2 ratio. I hate getting old. . .
“. . .I use Testors Insignia Red ( 8 parts) with Testors Brown #1166 ( 2 parts.) *The Testors Brown is a light color with yellow/orange terra cotta color. * More a medium brown. *This creates a very flat ‘Indian Lake Red’ that R. Rimell avowed in his Windsock special 1988. *Thoroughly mixed its great. *I keep a bottle of this mixture around and use it mixed with other colours to lighten or darken as needed. When you do it its the unmistakable blood red. *Also A. Toelle has seen good samples of MvR fabric (German 60 count calendared fabric) he seems to agree. *The information we have on 425/17 can be verified in ‘Richthofen’ by the late A.E.Ferko Albatros Pub. Ltd. . .”
Here is an older diorama of mine.
If this plane is supposedly the Gifted 425/17 why would it have the Iron crosses? It Wouldn’t, as it was gifted to MVR in 1918 and the Iron Cross wasn’t used then. I believe this is 477/17. And Someone Please answer the question, Why was The 477/17 MVR’s Most successful Fokker and yet No For Certain photos of it?