Gentleman,
I’m not a photographer, but I do want to take some decent shots of my WIP and finished models. I have a Cannon Rebel XTI. It does take pretty good pictures, but, with the current 18-55mm lens, up close shots are not so good. I was looking at purchasing a 10-18mm lens for up close shots. But, before I do, I figured I would ask those who know. Thank you in advance for your suggestions.
Hey Bruce, being a commercial photographer for most of my life and I did teach college level advanced photography for several years, I’ll try to help. First, what’s “not so good” with the 18-55? That lens should focus fairly close, at least the Nikon version does. The 10-18 will only be wider (smaller image at the same distance) which sometimes gets so close that you are blocking the light. Macro lenses focus real close and the longer ones (60 up to 200mm) and more give you more working distance which is good on insects and venomous snakes. Lighting is important and I usually use a broad fluoresent light. A tripod is a must and will allow you to use smaller f stops which will increase your depth of field. More info if you need it, feel free to ask! Glad to help.
Max
Max,
Here is a photo I took last night:
This is with the 18-55mm lens that came with the camera. I’m researching a small photo studio because I know the lighting is not good in these pictures. I do have another 55-200mm lens with IS that I will try. I was doing some research and seen the Macro lens sound like what I need, but, I’m not sure I want to drop that kind of cash on a lens right now. Thank you for the help, Max!
Hey Bruce, there are also inexpensive close-up filter sets that screw into the front threads of the lens that will get you closer. The 18-55 is a good lens and should work well for what you are doing. The 55-200 will probably not focus close enough for your needs. Try shooting something close with the 18-55 at wide-open and then stopped down all the way and you will see a remarkable gain in depth of field. Of course the exposure times increase and that’s where the tripod comes in. There’s no reason you can’t be shooting excellent stuff with the lens you have. Keep after it and give me a report! We can work on the lighting next.
Max
I just tried the other lens, I was incorrect, it’s 70-300mm. I will look into the close-up fliters. I’ll give you a report next week. Driving to Alabama for a short, but needed vacation tomorrow!
If you had a Nikon, I would recommend the standard kit lens, an 18-55 mm macro zoom. The neat feature is it is macro at all focal lengths, not just the telephoto (longest) focal length. That allows closeup wide angles, which make models look larger, more massive.
However, a solution to your problem is to use either supplemental lenses, add on lenses often called close-up lenses) that screw into the filter holder of your normal lens, or an extension tube, an attachment, or set of attachments that mount between the camera and the lens.
For many years I used the supplemental closeup lenses, but bought my first extension tube set. I am really fascinated by it- it allows much closer shots than the supplemental lenses.
Which to buy first depends on just how close you want to get. If you only want overall shots of your models, and especially if you build in larger scales, the supplemental lens set would be better. If you build in smaller scale (1:72, 1:144), or want real close shots showing part of the model, the extension tube might be the way to go. Either approach generally is cheaper than a whole new macro lens.
Say Bruce, I had the same problem. Standard focal length DSLR lenses are not good for really closeup work unless, something more is added to make it work. Let’s face it. Most of what we are working with is very small, and it requires special gear that can get down to that macro level.
I researched getting a macro lens, or possibly extention tubes already discussed. In fact, I went to a camera dealer with the intent to buy one or the other. Good mojo was with me that day because when I explained to the sales person what I was using it for, he offered up another option. “How about buying a point and shoot camera with macro built in?”
He tells me about a camera that his wife uses and how she loves it. He pulls one out of stock for me to try. I start playing with it and holy cats, you can really get in close. I was sold. At the time I paid $175.00, and they are still out there for about that price. That is more than half the price of a good macro lens, and if memory serves me right, about the same price of an extention tube set for my camera.
The camera that I purchased is a Canon SX600 HS. This little gem was worth every penny. It even has built in wifi capability so that I can transmit the images to my PC. It fits the bill for 98% of the shots that I need, and I tell you, it is hassle free. About the same percentage of shots are all handheld.
Consider this for a second. How much time will you be using to setup your DSLR with attachments? Also, whether using special gear or a dedicated macro lens, you might need to use a tripod. DSLRs are bulky and heavy.
The camera that I bought is perfect for this hobby. There is virtually no setup time. You just point, and shoot.
Just another option for you to consider.
PS: I guess Mo Jo is a bad word.
Bakster has a point Gang. I’m a professional photographer going back 50+ years and have about every useful Nikon lenses you would ever need to handle any assignment you can think of. If you caught my post a few days ago on the 1/48 Revell F-14A Tomcat you would probably be interested to know that two different cameras were used. This first shot on the grid with dark blue was shot with an $8000 Nikon DSLR 24MP full frame D3X with a special $1500 Micro 85mm with tilt/shift capabilities that allows me to extend the depth of field. The following shots on white were shot with a $350 P330 Nikon point and shoot Coolpix. Hard to tell the difference on the internet. The P330 (now the P340) shoots JPEG and Raw files and has a 24-120 35 equivalent lens with close-up capability. It also has Manual and Auto modes. I also post on a Hodaka motorcycle forum and use the point and shoot for everything from repair processes, close-up to overall pictures. The point being here is the point and shoot meets the requirements for this type of work for less than the cost of a DSLR lens. I do use the big guy for things like magazines and brochures where you do need lens selections and extreme file size. Different tools for different missions. Something to think about.
Max
Say Max, that is also a good point about some of the PS features available. The Canon that I have is pretty much a bare bones unit that serves me well. However, coming from the DSLR world, I do wish that it had more manual control capability. Specifically, being able to control the depth of field. There are on occasion instances that I would like to blur the background more, mainly to reduce the background clutter. With my camera, I do not have that kind of control. So, I have to make an effort to manually declutter things from the scene. It’s not a terrible thing, just that it is little more work at times, and I am inherently lazy.
Like you said though, different tools for different missions. My camera works well for my purpose but for someone that really wants to dive in with a PS and is willing to spend a little more, get one like P340 that Max mentioned. That offers more control and Raw files would be a nice thing too!
All true Bakster. That’s just the one I use and was hesitant to admit that pros use point and shoots! Maybe I’m just getting lazy in my old age but it sure is quick and easy to post something quick and easy that actually does a good job. Photobucket somehow kills a lot of resolution in the transfer. The Hodaka motorcycle Forum stores your pictures rather than a third party and are much sharper. I even turn down the resolution on the little Nikon to prevent producing too large of file. Not only is it much sharper on that site but you can enlarge it even further. I’m sure ther are other Nikon and Canon P&S that are as good or better but this one certainly does what I ask of it. I don’t have the link handy but if you want to see some examples of the Nikon P330 in action go to Strictly Hodaka/Forum and the Hodakamax post on the “Day One Project” which is a many month documented motorcycle project. It’s just a 1/1 model, same deal, check it out.
Max
Max, I can’t agree more. I like to spend less time fiddling with the camera and more time building.
I see what you mean about the Hodaka Forum and your images. That is sweet in the way that they look, and in the way that they display. Using my IPad I am able to expand the images right from within your post. Unlike with the cumbersome PB method that takes a person to PB and then the process therein. Ugh…
That is a cool project BTW.
Hey Baxter, quite a difference in resolution huh! (and ten times faster.) I shoot, tune and crop to site in about three minutes. I have to dust the subject on close-ups because dust and scratches show up that you can’t see with the naked eye. Seriously!
As for the Vintage Hodaka project, I’m sure you can see that it’s just a big 1/1 model with challenges and problems to solve. Nothing has to be stock or original which gives it a different twist. Kinda the ultimate scratch build. It’s kept me intertained and behind in modeling for over a year. Back to the Stuka and Phantom soon!
Max
Max, yes to them being much better and… displaying much faster. No doubt.
“I have to dust the subject on close-ups because dust and scratches show up that you can’t see with the naked eye. Seriously!”
I am laughing here because that is my experience as well. When using the macro mode it reveals things that the human eye can’t see, even if I have magnifiers on.
In that vein, a quick story. When I had first got back into modeling I went out and purchased a new airbrush. When it came time to use it, I was having issues with splattering. I eventually sought out for some help here. Various things were suggested and tried. The problems remained. Early on it was suggested that I check the needle tip by feeling it with my fingers. I did feel a kind of roughness but I really couldn’t say if that was the issue. Later, and when all other options were exhausted, I took a macro photo of the tip. I loaded it to my computer and then expanded the image to its near maximum. Eureka! There was the problem. The tip was bent over like a fishing hook.
LOL, I’m 73 years old and I tell everbody “It gets worse!” LOL again.
Max
Thanks for the warning! LOL…
Going by the images the op has submitted, looks to be more a problem of either camera shake, or just too close to the subject?
Every camera, whether using a macro setting or some kind of special lens, has a minimum focus length - or am I wrong here?
I’d first check and make sure you have the optimum settings for both picture size and quality. From there, just make sure the subject is within hash marks of the camera lens to ensure sharpness. In photo shop you can crop out the extremities and will find you still have a large image that requires to be shrunk down.
Again, going back to the posted images, if these were taken with a white background, consideration should be taken for better lighting, or try shooting in natural lighting and adjust the light meter for either scenario.
regards,
Jack
Hey Jack, Thanks for your input. As we photographers say “there’s more than one way to get a bad picture.” The challenge in close-up is that the closer you get the less depth of field you have. Stopping down the lens all the way helps but the closer you get you soon exceed the capabilities or limits of the lens. Shorter lenses have more depth of field and the smaller sensor size in a point and shoot helps this situation. Also when you stop down for more depth of field you must compromise with longer exposure times requiring a tripod and/or even higher ISO values. It’s always a compromise in close-up photography.
Max
A few thoughts…
On Jack’s comment about DOF above, that was my first thought a few days ago when I saw the OP’s posted pic. Didn’t look like an inability to focus close to me.
On Steve’s (Bakster’s) comment about a P&S, as an amateur of about 45 yrs with over $20k of kit sitting around, I cringe a little bit these days when nice folk like the OP have a reasonable goal in mind and want to go out and buy a fancy lens for their DSLR for some specific purpose like this one. It could be a fun and rewarding experience, or it could be expensive overkill. Sort of depends on the individual and amount of effort I suppose. P&S’s (and lately, even smartphones (cough, cough, can’t believe I just said that) do a surprising job indeed on some ‘close-ups’.
Best of luck to the OP regardless of which direction you go.
Edit: Bruce, my apologies for having referred to you as “OP” a few times above. I forgot who started the thread whilst replying. And obviously couldn’t view the thread whilst doing so.
One more thing about close-up photography is that as you magnify a subject you are projecting a bigger image on the sensor. Just as in a slide or movie projector the further you are from the screen the larger the image is. The problem is as you get further away the light falls off with the square of the distance. It’s the same in close-up photography, when you double the size of the object, it is two squared and requires four times the light. It starts getting out of control say at 9x magnification where you need 81x the light. Yet another problem among many in close-up photography.
Max