Getting interested in biplanes. There’s a nice site http://www.ww1aircraftmodels.com/ that includes a scale equivalent chart for WWI aircraft rigging lines that were originally between 8-4mm. Unfortunately, I can’t find any mention of which size would refer to which lines. Anyone know what a ballpark figure would be for landing wires, flying wires, control cables and whatever held the undercarriage together? Be a real help: I know some modelers like thin wire and it’s out there. Sounds worth a try, but I’d like to get the right size. Maybe there isn’t a one size fits all answer, but right now I don’t really have much of a clue (other than the 32d or 48 scale equivalent of something between 4-8mm).
Flying wires and control cables are generally thicker than bracing wires… But I’m a stretched sprue guy for that application, and I always use my calibrated Mk I Eyeball…
Try .03 and .04 invisible nylon thread sold at places like Walmart and craft stores. For turnbuckles you can use the hollow plastic Q Tip handles stretched over a candle. They retain the hollow part so the wire can be slipped thru then secured with a drop of CA. You can make them any size and a single handle will produce several.
0.15mm would be an accurate size for 1/32 scale, but I’m with Hans (except for the stretched sprue part). I use .3mm grey EZ-Line for that scale and it looks ‘right’ according to my eyeballs. EZ-Line can also be ‘peeled’ to a smaller diameter for 1/48. It’s super stretchy and very forgiving - IOW, it can take a fair share of abuse once installed and bounce right back.
At $1.80 each, with free shipping, it’s enough to last a good while, and you get a uniform size. Personally, I think the 1/64" tubing would work best for a 1/32 turnbuckle (1/2" diameter).
At some point, though, we get into the whole issue of accurate being expressed in hundredths of a millimeter. To me it sort of goes into the same territory as barrel openings, where obsessing about having the exact right size is more or less pointless.
As long as you’re not using, I don’t know, pipe cleaners or something, you should be alright.
I use 012mm Beadalon from Michels it looks good and dose’nt look oversized the turnbuckles and eye bolts I use I get from willam Walthers ( Termanal Hobby Shop) there made by Tichey Train Groope. ACESES5 ON BENCH TAMYIA 1/48 HYAKUSHIKI SHITEI KAI[bgr][::DD0]
I’m no purist and believe firmly in the eyeball. But there seem to be a hundred ways to rig one of these things (I want to know a good one to improve ship rigging skills - I could use some help there.) and seem folk do like thin metal rod. That I do have to order and having some idea of size would make it a lot easier. There are some tutorials on turnbuckles but I still haven’t figured out exactly what you do with the dam tubing and the buckles. (Hardest thing to do in teaching is put yourself in the head of someone that knows nothing. Used to teach US history to foreign students. If said, “The Quakers founded a colony in Pennsylvania” I always used a map because few of them had a clue where Pennsylvania was. True with some Americans too.)
I’ve bought some of the DVDs put out by MIG and AK - learned a lot too about weathering armor. Someone ought to do one on biplanes - I’d pay $20 without thinking to watch a good modeler illustrate the best ways to set the wings and rig the plane. Even the best photo build can’t touch a hour long video. Phil Foley in the UK is making a nice little business based around video builds. He doesn’t do biplanes.
Piano-wire as well… Most Lindberg biplane kits include a couple feet of it, which is way more than one needs… But it’s available at about any hobby shop too…
Personally I have found the cut to length wire method works for me (guitar string). I build in 1/72 though so I don’t have a need for turn buckles. In 1/32 they are a fairly noticable feature, I wouldn’t say required, but they certainly do add a lot.
I don’t know about any videos, but Steven Lawson offers some instructional WW1 DVDs and downloads. I haven’t seen him around here lately, but he is fairly active on Aeroscale.
Aeroscale also has an active early aviation forum, and is currently doing a Knights of the Sky GB so is more active than normal. Even just lurking there and reading some of the how to posts can provide a ton of information.
If yer gonna go the music wire, that is, guitar string route, there are on-line retailers and some music stores that will sell unpackaged individual strings, which means they are not coiled into the little envelopes and therefore don’t have to be straightened when they become flying/landing wires. I buy my strings on line, 72 sets at a time, as I am changing about once a week on 3 guitars, and this gives me a boatload of “ends”, about 4 to 7 inches of excess string that goes into a box for modeling. It is the only way I can make Bluegrass music profitable!
For the turnbuckles - fine wire and 29GA thin wall stainless steel tubing [hypodermic needles] - I strongly suggest against using wire or stretched sprue as the rigging adds a great [!] deal of structure to the model [it won’t be as wobbly]
Here’s a couple examples.
these are 24GA SS turnbuckle bodies.
How timely. Here is a post I just put in the Great War GB for the wire and turnbuckles I am going to use. Keep in mind the wire “scale up” is for a 1/32 aircraft.
Just got a email from the guy that runs http://www.ww1aircraftmodels.com and he says that not even museum people have really good numbers of width of real lines & cables. So even with a scale table, it looks like the eyeball remains the “go-to” weapon.
As far as blinking tubes and buckles go, I’m a clutz so I bought some of both from Bob’s Buckles in the UK: they’re cheap, they’re supposed to be very good and they’ll be here fast. I’m a baby-boomer and our solution for a problem is to throw money at it. You can bet places that sell modeling supplies like me. It’s the only way to keep the recovery recovering (we are recovering aren’t we?), and if I can’t afford to buy something like a cabin or a Mercedes, might as well plunge for paints and buckles.
Hans, gotta be clear here. You have talent and thus have fewer modeling problems to throw money at. If I knew what I was doing, I wouldn’t be out buying two kinds of needle threaders and 36 gauge beading wire like I did tonight. (BTW: I did get some Beadalon - not sure it’s the right scale for 32 biplanes, but I think it will be very nice for some 350 scale ship rigging.)
Actually got some real data on what wires on biplanes looked like in real life. Thus comes from the aforementioned site http://www.ww1aircraftmodels.com :
Now, if enough people start building biplanes we can knock modelers for having flying wires out of scale at least 15%. Make the armor folk feel at home. (Actually ship fans might be even greater data addicts.)
Eric
At 10:58 PM 3/10/2011, you wrote:
Hello Eric,
Just a quick note with some information I received today.
I spoke to Richard at Wingnut Wings today regarding rigging wire sizes on WW1 aircraft, like me, he said that there were many different sizes used. He did have these sizes on hand which pertained to a Roland D.VIa from original specs.
5mm (0.15mm in 1:32) rear flying wires
4mm (0.125mm in 1:32) front flying wires, front landing wires and front undercarriage wires
3.5mm for rear landing wires, cabane and wing struts.
I also spoke to Mal, Chief Engineer at HARS (Historical Aircraft Restoration Society), they are only a half hour drive from my place. He said that he knows little about WW1 aircraft rigging but the Tiger Moth they have has been re-rigged using modern wires with sizes ranging from 3/16 inch to 1/4 inch and 3/32 inch for control wires. Where a straight run is required they use stainless steel and cables around pulleys they use carbon steel. The flying wires on the Tiger Moth are tensioned to about 50lb.
