I’m fairly new to the armour modelling world, this is actually my first serious attempt at an armour model so try not to laugh. I picked up this old and decidedly inaccurate kit off the bay a while ago, wanted to try my hand at some german armour. well i’ve been reading a lot of techniques on this board so I decided to try to learn and practice the techniques on this one before i work on anything expensive or practice for the kursk gb. It’s a Tamiya Panther ausf A, with hot iron zimm inspired by crockett’s konigstiger… though he does it much much better. something i noticed is the zim doesn’t look like it’s to scale, and it’s pretty uneven. I’m not sure why i went with the vertical zimm… but it’s a bit late to change that now. i’m not entirely sure how i am going to be able to brush paint it either (i don’t have an airbrush)
I’d appreciate all the guidance and criticism you could give me… I can only get better [8D] i hope.
excuse my camera, it’s a cell phone camera with poor lighting
I think you are being too hard on yourself, that looks pretty good to me. I don’t think that vertical zim lines on a Panther are a bad thing either. There is nothing wrong with brush painting armor, I would use the rattle can however. You can do some pretty impressive work with MM or Tamiya spray cans, with some creative masking techniques…
If you ask me, you’re off to a good start on this Tamiya “old” A, can’t wait to see the finished product. Remember, the great thing about hot iron zim is you can always sand it back if it gets a little too “gnarly”. You’ve taken care to keep your lines straight, and once you’ve got some paint on there I think you will be very pleased.
Im no expert on Armor but it looks great to me. I think even if you did hand paint the kit it wouldnt look too bad. Its not like an A/C where it has to look smooth. Tanks were always agricultural and, a little bit rough painting wouldnt look bad at all.
hey no worries on brush painting, i had to hand paint my entire Dragon Panther A Late with a brush, i just used a wide brush and it worked perfectly. im lookin to get an airbrush but i dont know what the best ones are, and there expensive too i hear, the zimm i like i read how it was done but forget what you use, a soldering gun isnt it?
thanks Steve, I really like how your konigstiger turned out, so i had to give the hot iron a whirl. I also tried the sandpaper like you said and it really helps fix the parts you sort of mess up. I actually started practicing on the scrap pieces to keep my lines straight and then i worked on the side of the hulls, by the time i got to the turrent and mantlet I screwed up less and less… so if you notice the side of the hull zimm botchups you’ll know what i mean [;)] The beautiful thing is it doesn’t take that long, but the fumes defintely gets to you. And i think it looks pretty good as well. Your tip on the other thread about using a pencil to keepthe lines really helped! I’m planning on priming the hull and turrent up, then getting three tamiya rattle cans for the paint job (standard mid war german paint scheme), and then scour the forums for more info on dry brushing and weathering techniques. so hopefully it turns out decently. Thanks for the encouragement and help
Luftwoller, danke schon!
Jagdpanther, interesting I’d love to see some pics
Specter, check out /forums/790390/ShowPost.aspx , you use a soldering gun. Crockett recommends a 15W but I only had a 30W… it’s a bit strong so better to go with a 15W. I will probably end up brushpainting parts of it, and probably the numbers and decals as well, rattle cans would probably give me a better texture on the zimm surface
Brumbles, thanks for your kind words, I’ve done most of it this past week so I hope i’m not rushing it too much… I’m going to take my time doing the paint and decals and weathering process… I would hate to disappoint after a good start.
tigerman, maybe one day i will be able to make zimm comparable to steve, if i’m lucky [bow]
here are some more pics, the model will be sprayed soon, i need time to go to the LHS and pick up the paint cans… and also pick out a scheme to do, make the masks etc. suddenly the building part seems the easiest! could anyone help me out with some questions? I didn’t plan too much… I think the decals will be Grossdeustchland or Das Reich… probably when the AUSF A first debuted. Mid1943? These coincide right? Also a tri-camo scheme, green yellow and redbrown, but I’m not too sure what the pattern would be… hard edged would probably be easier with a rattle can right? anyone have any ideas?
KoenigTiger, although I would agree that the width of the ridges are a bit ovescale, there is nothing at all wrong with your pattern. The height of each row looks good and I think the overall eveness is well within German norms. As far as the vertical ridge pattern goes, that would be the most appropriate pattern for the Panther A.
Oddly enough, I think the Zim will help with brush painting because the pattern will hide any brush mark. Just brush with the grain and make sure that the paint gets into the bottom of the ridges. When doing camo, you might want to try using a strippling technique, basically dabbing down with the brush rather than actually stroking it. Although not as good as an airbrush, with a light hand, one can actuall get a fairly decent soft edge between the camo colors.
If you go with the rattle cans, you might want to try some silly putty or Playdo as a mask. Just spray the whole tank in Dark Yellow, let it cure and then apply your silly putty for the olive green and red brown. You can also go with just one color, red brown or olive green.
thanks for the tip Steve, I’m wondering, would a cardboard 1 piece mask not work? i mean, it would take some of the hard edge off the tank if you distance the tank and mask properly during spraying no?
I have used cardboard masks using a rattle can back in the day, they can be kind of a pain, you dont get a “3 dimensional” mask with them, and you get overspray. I wouldn’t worry to much about the edges, you can fade them with pastel chalk or pigments after the base coat is lain down. Try the playdo thing, you won’t be sorry. Here is a Panther I did using Playdo a couple of years ago:
There is nothing wrong with just Dunkelgelb for an A model:
The real secret is not to worry too much about german cammo patterns ,and to an extent, colors, in the base coat stage. What makes the model is the finish weathering and fading techniques which make the vehicle look realistic:
Before:
After:
Just go for it, use your imagination and have blast.
thanks again Steve, your encouragement is helping me focus on learning the best i can. Those are some really nice Panthers, the details are great! How do you make the tracks look metalic? do you spray them with a colour and add the details with the AB? I think I’ll give the playdough a whirl. I primed the Panther today, so it’s ready for the paint job but i have yet to paint the wheels… I need to hit the hobby shop for red brown, dunkelgreb and OD, thats why i’m surfing other people’s builds instead of working on my own [;)]. It’d save me a lot of time since this is just a training kit. What kind of oils and materials do I need to weather it properly? I’m sorta on a budget so a few neccessities would be much appreciated.
Well, first of all…the track is Fruimodel, all metal stuff and a set will run about $35.00 and up. I do spray them with a dirty red brown black mixture w/the AB. You can use a circle template to mask off the rubber on the road wheels. The correct color will be Olive Green (Olivgrun) not OD. There are some guys who really like “washes” with oils, just super thinned burnt umber oils usually. This leeches down into the cracks and crannies and brings out the details. I would say at a minmum you should get some NON OIL based pastel chalks, they are cheap and you can ground these up and use them dry or with water/thinner to dirty up the beast, add stains and exhaust shading/rust too.
Just experiment with different stuff, you’ll get the hang of it. Remember to weather the vehicle from the bottom up, the most grime and dirt closer to the road, and use your own experience…you may have seen construction equipment …where does the dust collect? apply this same reasoning to weathering your model.
I personally don’t use oils, I feel they darken the models too much, but there are some excellent builders who do use it (Ron Goins). Save some of the dark yellow in your rattle can for some fading. After you apply decals, stand back a ways and mist coat the whole shebang with the last of your DY, this will add a layer of fine dust and blend your cammo and age your decals to blend it all in.
I think that zimm looks better then mine for sure. You can get right into the tight spots whereas mine I can’t so I have some bare spots. Mine is done with a razor saw, and putty. Your zimm looks spectacular.
Michael, Thanks, you should give it a try as well, it’s really quite simple!
Steve, I’ll definitely get some pastel chalks for the weathering part, I’m planning on burshpainting my own markings onto the tank, the zimm might be a bit uneven for the decals. I’ll see if i have some of those oils around, I have some art supplies lying around so it’s time to experiment!
If i did a tri colour scheme, would this work? i am thinking this would be my order…
spray dunkel greb
make playdough mask for red brown stripes, spray redbrown
set playdough for olivgreb stripes spray og
let dry, paint on decals, let dry, add mist of dunkelgreb
I would apply the oils before misting, You want to thin burnt umber and apply in weld seams, crevices etc. Now, a lot of builders who use oils recommend coating the model with a gloss coat, such as Future floor polish, allowing 48 hrs. to cure. Then apply the wash. This gloss coat allows the thinned wash to “run” into panels and crevices, and lets you wipe off the excess. Once complete, apply a flat coat, I use Polyscale flat. If you don’t want to do this, you will have to very carefully apply “pin point washes” and it is very meticulous.
I would not recommend hand painting the markings. I did it on the Panther D, and it was hell. I have a large collection of Archer fine transfers, both Balkenkreuze and turret numbers. These are the ticket over zimmerit. They are available direct from Archer, on line, and are reasonably priced. If you can’t afford them, PM me and I will send you what you need for your Panther.
Here are my hand painted markings, this took great care and patience: If you look cloely, you will see where I have applied pin washes in the welds seams etc., then mist coated over the entire tank…
Believe it or not, these are the kit decals on this CH/Dragon Late Tiger 1:
I used a product called “Solvaset” to soften these decals into the zimmerit, and it worked out well. You might want to consider using decals, with the setting solution, they will work quite well.
When I built my Panther A I had the same mindset. If you do decide to go with brushpainting, you find that it is easier to do a combination of masking and brush painting. The unit numbers are usually a dark color, (red, green or black) outlined in white. The problem is how to paint an outline in white, keeping it reasonably even and getting coverage.
The solution I used was to first paint the areas that would receive the markings with white enamel. I then cut masks for the numbers and crosses out of Tamiya Yellow Tape. After applying the masks and pressing them into the Zimmerit coating, I then painted the three color camo. In spite of what might think there was very little bleed, and after peeling up the masks and touching up the the occasional bleed area, I had all the markings blocked in white.
The next step was to carefully brush in the center portion of the numbers, leaving a thin white line. Because the area is much wider than the white outline, it was very easy to paint close to the edge and leave a fairly even line. For the interior color, I used an acrylic black. By using acrylic over the white enamel, I had no issues with the underlying paint lifting.
