Swap Meet Score!...and a concern.

Just got back from a local Swap Meet, and found a vintage Revell Thermopylae kit…4 bucks! (as an aside, I also found a tiny kit of a Pinta…the hull is about 3 inches long! That’ll be a fun one! 50 cents!)

But back to the Thermopylae…

I was a little concerned since the box was really rough, but after getting it home, all appears complete! There are two big, unopened bags of parts (one all white, one Black and Tan)…even found the decals in the instruction sheet pages…though they look old and will probably not work (?)…

Anyway, my concern is that someone had apparently masked over the upper wales along each hull half, and probably left it on there for 20 years! Then, I further speculate that someone later tried to remove the tape, but failed…there is now a stripe of old dried up tape residue along both sides of the outer/upper hull.

Question: What is a safe chemical to use on the styrene of the hull that will get the residue off, but not damage the plastic? I first thought of Rubbing alcohol, but then I figured I should ask the experts!

Any advice?

Thanks!

BTW, this kit looks super fun! Tons of parts, and she’s huge! haha

I think isopropyl alcohol would be fine, I’ve never had a problem with it on plastic. One of the orange cleaners (e.g. Goo Gone) might be okay as well, just not sure about residue. Simple Green might get the glue residue off and won’t harm the plastic.

Paul

Good score…are you planning on correcting the serious Revell errors? Or build as is?

i’ve used wd-40 to remove old tape.

Ha! Errors, Shmerrors!

[H]

I’v said it before and I’ll say it again… TESTORS Easy Lift Off !!

Takes off evrything wont hurt the plastic.

I’ll second the Isopropyl. It is fine on plastic but it does a fair job of removing masking tape adhesive. There is also something made specifically for removing that sort of stuff- I think it is called goo gone or something similar, that I have used a couple of times, but not that often. I would try a test on that stuff one a piece of sprue. But I know Iso is fine.

Like many other modelers, I’ve found that automotive brake fluid is an excellent paint remover for styrene plastic. Get a can of the stuff and pour it into some sort of disposable container (which, if this is the 1/96 kit, will have to be pretty big). Soak the part for an hour or so and hold it under a faucet in the sink (or, in this case, bathtub). Almost all the paint will come off immediately. If any of it is stubborn, go after it with an old toothbrush. I’ve never run into the masking tape problem, but I suspect denatured alcohol would take off the residue. (I’ve heard it said that ammonia will do it, but that strikes me as a little risky. Ammonia is a mild solvent for some forms of plastic.)

It needs to be said, I think, that the Revell Thermopylae (or Thermopylaes; Revell issued versions in two scales) are, in terms of scale modeling, marketing scams. The original, 1/96-scale one is nothing more or less than a reissue of the company’s Cutty Sark, with some detail changes (some of which make reasonable sense, while others apparently were just made to make the kits look different). In reality the two ships looked like each other from a distance of a mile or so, but that’s about all. How important the discrepancies are depends, of course, on the individual modeler, but making a scale model of the Thermopylae out of that kit would be almost as challenging as scratchbuilding - maybe more so.

Then you plan on building the Thermopysark…then? :frowning:

Almost as much as my Cutty conversion to the Glory of the Seas…Now that was a near total scratch build.

Thanks for the suggestions about the tape residue!

Now it might be time for me to go on a slight rant.

Look, you guys…it’s obvious why so many people on this forum choose to exchange email addresses and correspond offline

First let me say that I appreciate the attention to detail that so many people show in their hobbying…I totally admire the skill and tenacity! Rob, you are an amazing model-builder…I don’t know how you find the time or the inclination to produce so many kits on such a great level of beauty!

But it really is kind of a drag when, as a casual modeler, I create a post to ask for some ideas, and in many cases the “Sharks” come out, and make comments about whether or not the kit in question is accurate enough, or whether it’s an actual representation of a specific era…come on. I’m not a historian, or sailing enthusiast…or a perfectionist.

I’m just a guy who likes to put together kits of stuff…sometimes it’s a ship, sometimes it’s a car.

I don’t care if a ship kit is authentic, and though I realize it’s unintentional, such remarks do more than demonstrate one’s vast knowledge about ships…it also can make another person feel like they are doing a half-ass job if they don’t correct the kit’s flaws. And it’s okay for anyone to think that way, but it’s slightly impolite to express it publicly. I don’t claim to be a master, but I do have some skill, and I’m learning more all the time, hopefully with the help of you all.

If this post had been created so that I could ask for input on whether the kit is accurate enough to be called the Thermopylae, or if I wanted some suggestions on how to make it more authentic, then of course all related insights would be welcome…

I’m just trying to get some tape residue off, not get brow-beaten for enjoying my hobby.

Please know that I write this with respect.

I hope I don’t get myself in trouble with the admins…I should probably just keep my mouth shut lol

Also, please don’t feel singled out if you have responded to this thread…I’m not trying to vilify anyone specifically, this is just a trend I’ve noticed generally across the forum.

Dave

Hmmm, well I would defend Tilley on this except for not wanting to start a flame war, and also I find the use of brake fluid only acceptable if the modeler then takes it to a disposal facility, like a brake shop. But that can be done, and no doubt he just forgot to mention it.

No, the reason you might consider advice on this, even if not requested, is that you must know by now that a ship model, esp. a really big one, takes many hundreds if not thousands of hours of time. And a very curious thing happens during that time. You get older, no mystery there. But you also spend a lot of time looking at information about the subject, and either fall in love with the thing or rue the day you met.

My own personal opinion is that it’s a fine model, and I would certainly build it, (well, after I finish that 1/100 Victory taking up so much room in the shop). But I would probably pick a fantasy subject. I had a lot of fun doing that with the little Revell Constitution back in my youth. It goes together rather quickly, so versions of it became Atropos or Caligula, or whatever wholly fictitious (as a 44) instrument of the Empire I needed on my shelf at the time. Just an excuse to paint Nelson Checker.

Likewise Stag Hound became Mustang (don’t ask).

Just my two bits,

GM

Dave…I am truly sorry for any discomfort and offence I may have implies and am extremely sorry for the trouble I have caused. I honestly did not intend to brow beat you concerning your wonderful purchase.

I am like you in many regards…it is a goodly detailed kit and getting it at such an incredible price was amazing…not to mention the simple question you asked about old tape residue.

Please allow me to retract any offensive remarks I made. Further…allow me to extend the hand of reconciliation and respect as a fellow modeler.

At times my own furvancy for accuracy comes off as something more then it really is.

Please accept my humble apology.

Rob

Dear Rob!

You are such a naughty boy! Good thing you corrected yourself! But I smell trouble, anyhow!

David - I sure hope you don’t get offended over this one! If the old salts here say this kit has its problems, it would be unwise just to ignore it. You have to make a decision and its 100% up to you! You’re investing your time and nobody is going to give it back to you when it’s already gone. By the way - for old tape glue, you might want to try lighter fluid (gasoline) to remove the stuff - works for me, and isn’t as toxic as brake fluid (I use this one for removing paint, though).

Good luck with your project and have a nice day

Paweł

Rob-

I appreciate your sincerity.

It’s not a huge deal, and I wasn’t trying to make anyone feel guilty…but I do hope my remarks help to clarify the mindset of a semi-casual modeler…I’ve only been working on ships for 16 months or so…perhaps as I get more seasoned, the importance of certain aspects of authenticity will become more important to me.

There are members here who feel that, very often, threads degenerate into off-topic complaints about various particulars. Some have even given up posting to avoid the nit-pickery…which is a shame, because there is so much to be learned from the experiences of other members here.

I have learned that model manufacturers will sometimes take shortcuts, even making superficial changes to an existing kit, re-boxing it, and slapping a new name on it to make a few bucks…it’s not good business. But in the end, I don’t mind so much, and I still enjoy building some of them…especially when I got it for 4 bucks!

And I absolutely enjoy seeing WIPs of those who take the time to make corrections and modifications as they see fit…Glory of the Seas is a great example.

Anyway, I’m not trying to get a reputation as a whiner, but I do like to speak my mind. :slight_smile:

Maybe down the road, when I’m ready to start in on the Thermopylae, I’ll start a post that asks,

“Hey, does anybody have some advice for making this kit into something better?”

:slight_smile:

Your position is well respected. Just a side note;

I scroll through many modeling forums and some are so extreme to detail and accuracy that even I am considered inept and a novice. Forgetting sometimes that everyone has a beginning and those beginnings can be encased in the simple joy of purchase and building of the model…NOT in any inaccuracies in the model itself.

Lets let the Purist subject rest for another thread.

Thanks for accepting my sincerest apology

Rob

Thanks again, Rob. You’re a class act.

I know about the other forums, which shall remain nameless! All friendly fellows, but I have seen the rivet-counters in their full glory over yonder! haha

And thanks to GMorrison…you make a good point…there are many hours spent in the building of a big ol’ model ship (except for Rob, he seems to kick out a sweet model each month! lol)…and I could definitely see how one would appreciate a heads-up before painting oneself into a corner, so to speak.

BTW, I got the old tape residue off with some rubbing alcohol and a generous dollop of elbow grease. Now I can lay the kit to rest in the closet until I decide to start building her, and I won’t have to deal with that pesky residue!

Dave

Not so fast young Jedi- we all got together and played a trick on you. The alcohol will warp your hull into a twisted mess unless you either start her immediately,

you EITHER start or what? I think you meant unless you start her immediately.

I think the dollop of elbow grease might be Dave’s saving grace…NOT our diverse suggestions.

I’m glad he got the antique goo off the hull.

Well, I seem to have set off something I didn’t intend. And I certainly don’t want to start a flame war. I’ve tried to clarify my position on such matters a couple of other times here in the Forum; maybe I should do it again.

I have no desire to tell any other modelers how to build models - or what models to build, or how. As far as I’m concerned ship modeling is a hobby. (I’ve never been a professional model builder, and have no desire to be one. There’s nothing wrong in the world with building models for money, but I personally have never been attracted by it.) The idea of having a hobby is to have fun (and maybe learn something in the process). If that means doing something other than building a scale replica of something, well, for heaven’s sake, that’s the individual modeler’s business. Some modelers - especially sailing ship modelers, it seems - get pleasure and satisfaction from building models that generally resemble real objects, but only by a very broad definition are scale models. Whether people do that is certainly none of my business. If a modeler wants to change a few parts of his B-17 and call it a B-24, or change a few parts of a Ford and call it a Chevy, I’ll defend to the death (well, maybe not quite that far) that modeler’s right to do so.

In (I hope) the near future, I’m going to build a model of a generic Gloucester fishing schooner, using the Model Shipways Elsie and the Bluejacket Bluenose as a basis. The model will be named "G.L. Tilley," after my father. It won’t be a scale model of any actual ship - and I won’t tell anybody that it is. But it should be great fun, and I’m learning a lot about fishing schooners as I get ready to build it.

Please let it be noted that, in the 4,252 posts I’ve made in this forum since 2004, I’ve never criticized the work of a modeler. If I think a model is particularly outstanding, I’ll say so. If not, I’ll keep my mouth shut. I have, I admit, offered occasional suggestions about specific points that I think/hope the modeler will find helpful. But my position is that if a modeler builds a model the way he/she wants to, that’s his/her privilege.

I do think, though, that manufacturers are fair game for criticism. Revell claims (or certainly implies clearly) that what’s in that box is a scale replica of the Thermopylae. It just plain isn’t. The hull is the wrong shape in several obvious places, the deck furniture is crazy, and there are some big inaccuracies in the sail plan. (Why Revell decided to leave out the studding sail booms that were in the original Cutty Sark kit is a mystery; the Thermopylae carried studding sails too.) The kit is a modified reissue of the Cutty Sark - and in my opinion the potential purchaser (to say nothing of the modeler who, not knowing what it is, decides to put scores of hours of time into it) is entitled to know that. In my opinion a company that markets a Cutty Sark kit as the Thermopylae (or the Bounty as the Beagle, or the Flying Cloud as the Stag Hound, or the Eagle as the Seadler, or any of the numerous other similar stunts Revell - and other companies - have played over the years) is committing consumer fraud. In just about any other industry, the perpetrators of such scams would get sued out of business.

For some reason or other (as we’ve also discussed previously in this Forum), the manufacturers of sailing ship kits seem to get held to lower standards than the manufacturers of other subjects. If a kit manufacturer did market a B-24 as a B-17, or a Ford as a Chevy, or a Panther tank as a Tiger, or, for that matter, a U.S.S. Iowa as the Arizona, my guess is that few, if any, members of this Forum would buy it. And the model magazines would make sure the company’s feet got held to the fire.

A few years ago the then-new company Trumpeter announced a 1/32 F4F Wildcat. When the first samples arrived in the U.S., it became clear that the fuselage was misshapen by, as I understand it, about 1/4". Squadron Mail Order refused to sell the kit, and Trumpeter changed the molds.

And those who’ve been around for a while may remember when Revell tried to market its old Type VII U-boat as the U-505 (the Type IX that’s preserved at the Chicago Museum of Science and Industry). Most people can’t tell the difference between a Type VII and a Type IX. (I rather suspect most of the people who were running Revell in those rough days honestly didn’t know the difference either.) But one of the modeling magazines (Scale Ship Modeler) blew the whistle - and so did the gift shop at the Museum. Revell took the kit off the market.

I personally would be happy if the same thing happened to the so-called Thermopylae kits. The 1/96 Revell Cutty Sark is a grand old kit - not up to today’s standards, but an excellent basis for a fine model. I wish Revell would put it back on the market ; it’s one of those kits that always ought to be available. (If it was, people wouldn’t have to look for it on E-bay - and put up with a modified reissue.) Deception of the public by manufacturers shouldn’t be part of scale modeling.

End of sermon. To each his/her own - but I don’t think manufacturers ought to put the label “scale model” on an object that is no such thing.

P.S. Gmorrison - I did indeed forget to mention the proper disposal of brake fluid. For heaven’s sake don’t pour it down the sink. Sorry about that.