Hmmm… I don’t think I said what you think I said… and that is actually kind of funny. Here we are, actually posting pretty clearly worded replies to one another, and still we are talking past one another. Your growing frustration with me indicates that I seem to be missing your point, and I feel you are missing mine. The funny thing is, I don’t think either one of us set out to get into a spat with the other - but that is what happens when you only have the written word to respond to, absent emphasis ans facial expression and body language.
That, to me, is why all that grammar ‘stuff’ is important - it’s already hard enough to communicate through this imperfect medium.
PS: “Arguement”… that’s funny. Hey, I never claimed to be perfect…[8-|]
It’s not about grammar. It’s about effective communication.
Now…I’m no stickler for grammar. I love starting sentences with “but” and hurl massive quantities of adverbs and overuse the ellipsis and yes, even use the dreaded passive voice.
But (see, there I go) this is the internet. Text is how we communicate with one another. And so it has to be comprehensible by others who read it.
People say that going all caps is the equivalent of screaming. Fair enough. By the same token, I think messy communications are the same as slurring your speech to the point where people can’t easily make out what you’re saying.
Browni, “Arguement” is really funny,but, only for two reasons,one, it is typed and not verbal, verbally, it wouldn’t sound any different
the other reason is the reason I pointed it out,it is a typo (word spelled wrong), in a thread about misspelled words
I am merely trying to stand up for a guy that I have learned is “of a certain age”, and belongs to a group of people that learned to type in a completely different way than I myself learned, and in a completely different way than anyone younger than my almost 56 years
all of those guys that learned on Underwoods have it different than those of us that learned on Selectrics and Selectric IIs,and the Selectric group learned differently than the ones that took “Keyboarding” in 8th grade, instead of High School typing class (or gasp !!!, didn’t take typing until college)
the bottom line is a simple question,if you ask at 11am saturday what color of yellow to get at the hobby shop before you run out for an hour’s drive to get the color, and someone types up an answer,can you read it well enough to know that you want a bottle of “Yellow, RLM 4”
if you can, and you get Gelb RLM 04,then the message was typed clear enough by the old guy that painted the yellow cowls on a 'Schmidt before I was a teen able to “just buy a tin of Humbrol or a bottle of Pactra”
and you are completely correct,I am sure neither of us set out to argue with each other about this
but, there is also a very logical reason for a person typing in All Caps
as a Mod on another site, I once had to learn NOT to ban a certain 65 year old English lady for constantly typing in all caps,and I wound up encouraging the chat room members that were her friends to go ahead and type in all caps while she was in the room
at the time, you didn’t have a simple scroller on your keyboard that enabled everything on the screen to be enlarged for you,the default font we are using right now would just wind up looking like gray lines to her
granted, most modelers can see pretty well,but, there are still some old people out there that “have always modeled” and still haven’t quit,that can’t see all that well anymore
heck,I should probably apologize for using the “comma ellipsis” so often,except that I mostly used a computer for “really big deal stuff” or in a chatroom,a lot of people used ellipsises(?ellipsi?),I developed the habit of using commas in mine to stand out to friends in the chatroom
Another forum I belong to has a grammar/spelling police and he is known to criticize others for the lack of grammar/spelling skills. Unfortunate for that man, he doesn’t know the difference in between Their, They’re, Your, You’re and so on, so only time I bust someone for the grammar/spelling error is when he makes those mistakes. I try my best to use proper grammar, spelling and punctuation as a courtesy and respect to others who might be reading my post, but English being my second language, I do slip up more often than I’d like to admit.
I’m all for good spelling and grammar but I think we need to accept that not everyone has the same level of understanding of grammar and spelling. With that said, a poorly written post won’t convey it’s message and everyone will ignore it. Then the person gets discouraged that no one reads their posts.
Texting is killing spelling and grammar as ppl try 2 get as much said in as few characters as they can. Or they use interwebs slang like boi and what not. That may be fine when texting u bros, but it isn’t when posting to a public form full of strangers that you want feedback from.
TL:DR: some basic mistakes are fine; we aren’t all English teachers. but writing error filled posts because you’re lazy is considerate to your fellow forum mates.
This conversation has taken a somewhat ugly turn. As an editor, misspellings and bad grammar are part of my job description … in the magazine. The Internet is a different kettle of fish and I don’t think anyone should be criticizing anyone else on FSM’s public forums for errors. This is an unproductive discussion that seems intended only to make other users feel bad about their use of language and/or typing skills. How’s about we drop it and get back to what we’re really here for: Constructive criticism and discussion of modeling.
For the sake of clarity, this note should be considered a warning. Any member posting inflammatory or abusive posts in this thread after this one will have their account suspended.
I don’t get it. Why do you seem so ticked off at me about this. The point I was trying to make in my last post (apparently none too clearly) is that we see this differently, so we are basically talking about different things. I wasn’t trying to be belligerent, I was just making a quick observation. No need to go all “in the smallest words I can” on me…
Look, you want me to concede that there are certain people, “of a certain age” is the phrase that I think you used, who struggle when using the internet to communicate. Fine, I’ve got no problem with that. But the entire topic of this thread is grammar, punctuation and diction in general, at least according to the title that the OP chose. That is the perspective I have been taking.
I’ll take Aaron’s advice and walk away, but I did at least want to try to clear the air because I feel like you took this as a greater offense than I ever intended it.
shrug, I see spelling in the title,and I don’t see grammar in the title
but, yeah, I probably took “more offense than you intended”
in person, these convos don’t get to this point,right after someone says something that gets taken the least bit wrong, they either clarify right away, or the other person says “what was that?”, and then the speaker changes the way he says it
I am still going to “shut up a bit” though,the next 47 things I think of to say go “against what people have always known” so much that they will just argue in defense of their own reps instead of adjusting the actual historical record online
I have no idea how the OP has his head wired, but as the parent of a gifted dyslexic, I’ve learned over the last 20 years that while language skills seem to be the most commonly understood measure of “intelligence”, they are in fact highly over rated as a true measure. Some people, maybe 10% of the population, just cannot perform well in writing.
I understand and agree with most of the posts here. However, when reading my local news paper, my head just explodes. Misspellings, wrong words being used, because of auto correct, and ABSOLUTELY no proofreading, before submitting the articles.
This has got to be one of the most ridiculous thread topics resulting in asinine arguments that I’ve seen in a long time. This is the kind of bologna that has ushered in the slow death of this forum.
If you come into my classroom and ask ANY of my students it will become very clear that I am a “grammar Nazi.” Why? Well it’s simple. I am a high school teacher with a Masters Degree who is working on a Doctorate. Academic writing is my biggest passion on this earth. That being said, as important as I think it is to be able to produce grammatically acceptable written work if the situation calls for it; forums simply don’t. You do not have to be a grammar aficionado to effectively communicate within a forum. If my professors throughout my college career were to read through all my posts on this and the various other forums where I have participated they would be shocked by the number of errors, typos, and such that litter my post. The biggest reason being that I am far too lazy to proofread what I type most of the time because frankly it doesn’t matter. My name is in no way attached to what I type on forums, and there is good reason for that. I need to have a certain level of anonymity. Now anything that is posted to my Facebook page, school message board, website, or blog that has my name attached to it is meticulously edited because it is attributed to me and reflects my professional and academic status.
It’s pretty ironic and hilarious that some of the people trying to make the argument in favor of flawless forum grammar are littering their posts with comma splices, sentence fragments, run-ons, etc. Don’t give me this bologna that you can’t understand what people are trying to say. Sure, there is a threshold where things become incomprehensible, but most people never approach it.
The problem with that theory, as I see it, if you write improperly here, you get in the habit of it and write that way all the time. There was a similar discussion over at ARC a few weeks ago. I have seen letters written inquiring about job opportunities written just like that person writes in texting and or the ‘carefree’ manner seen in forums. Granted, they were menial labor jobs, but… Typos and the like are one thing, but just being lazy and looking ignorant because you can is something entirely different.
I can write just fine if I am writing a chapter, or various chapters scattered all over the book series, heck, I even “switch tech terms” to match which deployment I am writing about at the time,the vacuum tube era had different terms than the solid state era, and topics that no longer exist
I even remember not to say “prolly” or use the comma ellispisese,when I am “writing for real”
when I post a technical item, I write it in proper TechSpeak for the time period of the aircraft I am writing about, then switch back to “Bug, Bug, SuperBug and ElectricBug” era when posting about today
Sure, that’s absolutely possible, but you can’t assume that to be the case for everyone. Let me add that there is a HUGE difference between typing something out on a forum and there being some spelling and punctuation errors and using “texting language.” I have zero patience for the latter and it’s nothing more than lazy, ignorant, and off putting. Think about it. When you meet someone in person their first impression of you is based on your appearance. Like it or not, that’s how it is. I’m not suggesting that it’s right or fair, but that’s why being well groomed and dressed well is so important. When the first, and only in the case of forums, impression you are giving someone is based on your writing you’ll just have to forgive me for forming a negative view because you can’t type out “b4” or “l8tr.”
You are exactly right. And that is why, to me, in my personal opinion, grammar and spelling and punctuation and all that stuff do matter. Since I am not meeting you in person, my opinion is based on your typed word. Does it have to be flawless? Of course not - I can’t meet that standard, I won’t hold anyone else to it. But I still prefer to read well written, concise, logical posts. It makes it easier to comprehend and, yes, I’ll admit it, it impacts the ‘image’ I have in my mind of the person who wrote the post.
It seems like we simply draw our line for forming negative opinions in a different place. You reserve yours for those who use ‘texting lingo’. Apparently, I’m not so forgiving (or perhaps I have higher standards [;)] - just kidding! It was a joke! Don’t lose your &%#@ on me!!!)
