At least as far as his book on Michael Wittmann goes Restayn invented nearly the whole story. He portrays Wittmann as using 222 while an obvious and very common photo shows very plainly that is impossible, because 222 is seen in perfect running order towing the damaged 231 immediately after the battle. I have heard on other forums, especially missing lynx, that Restayn does this in all his books. While there is some great info there, don’t trust something he says if it conflicts with multiple alternate accounts.
I thought this was quite funny…
In 1943 when the Tiger first entered combat, the crews had little or no training, resulting in less than expected performance. Soon the Russians managed to capture an intact Tiger, and immediately set about writing a manual for the Russian tank crews explaining its strengths and weaknesses. In turn, the Germans captured some of the Russian Tiger manuals, and found them to be so helpful that they had them translated to German and distributed to all Tiger crews[;)]
[:D]
[:O] bit ironic! [:D]
There is an interesting chapter on Herman Bix in “Panzer Aces” if you have access to it [:)]
Hey guys I’m a little confused.[%-)] I was originally under the impression that we were building a vehicle in which the particular Panzer Ace was ALREADY an ace and in command of (I hope this makes sense).
I’ve noticed your advice to others regarding which armor is OK to build for an ace (ie Ernst Barkmann’s Panther D, A, & Gs), . After initially doing a miniscule amount of research on Barkmann I realized that the Panther D he used during the Kursk offensive was a vehicle in which he wasn’t in command of, but was actually just the gunner (don’t know how accurate this info is). I kind of thought then that a Kursk Panther D wouldn’t be appropriate. But now I am seeing that any vehicle is OK as long as the ace used it during his combat career. Am I correct? Is so then it opens up even more possibilities than I thought of!
Sorry to be so confused, but then again I am a bufflehead! [:P]
This has always been debated, because even Carius, Wittmann and Knispel each scored at least 1/4 of their total as a gunner. And what happens in the situation of Bobby Woll, who scored nearly 100 kills as Wittmann’s gunner, and then went on to 80 of his own as a commander? Do the kills belong to Wittmann or to Woll? If you give them to Woll, like was done in the case of Carius and Knispel, he is easily the highest scoring commander, surpassing Carius and Knispel. But since Wittmann was an important propaganda tool, it wouldn’t do to go giving his kills to his gunner, now would it? Even when it was his gunner whose deadly accuracy and quick thinking had saved the whole crew dozens of times?
I think the question to answer is, to whom is the entire crew’s success due?
An example: In the case of Wittmann’s expliots at Villers-Bocage, the credit should all go to Bobby Woll, whose fire-on-the-move skills are what enabled the lone Tiger to successfully rout the British 7th Armored. Wittmann was a fairly accurate gunner but could not hit anything while his tank was moving. With a different gunner, the skirmish would probably have had a different outcome.
So I think if you answer that question, the problem will be solved. And in most cases, like Barkmann, even as a gunner the ace-to-be was probably the strong point of his crew.
(I am not sure he wasn’t the commander of his Panther at Kursk, because he is recorded as ordering the platoon to weld buckets over their intakes, not something a lowly gunner would do)
Me personally, being less of a stickler on rules and more interested in the history and experiences of all these brave men, am totally ok with building a tank they served with at an earlier time.
Not unlike building Adolph Galland’s first Bf 109 during the Spanish Civil War, for example. It was one of the planes he flew before he was an Ace, it is instantly recognizable and is a part of what made him who he was.
So from my perspective, it’s totally ok. A tank is more or less successful because of all of the efforts of the commander and crew. I hesitate to always give the credit to just the commander as the gunner has to have quick and accurate marksmanship, the loader quick, the driver has to be in sync with the commander and gunner etc. [2c]
[#ditto] It’s team work
Very informative text on Leon Degrelle.
http://www.barnesreview.org/degrelle2.htm
I didn’t know he was excommunicated by the Pope!
I came across this photo while researching the Nashorn (Nuts and Bolts #14 Nashorn, excellent Nashorn reference which I highly recommend if you’re interested. It’s a bit hard to find, but I managed to find a new one on e-bay for about $45).
I love how this photo illustrates in one shot the variances in German camouflage, even among tanks in the same platoon. Look at #231 on the right, looks like a very hastily (or lazily [;)])done series of 3 wavy lines, as compared to the other two Nashorns who’s camo patterns look more like what we’d expect for the time peried, although they are both very different as well.
So, the point I’m trying to convey here is that the German camouflage was mostly done in the field, with loos guidelines. It was up to the individuals that were spraying, brushing or slopping on the paint with whatever means or tools available to paint the camo as they saw fit. This makes for an incredible variety in paint schemes. [:-^]
Thats good to hear… it took me a week to figure out which kit and which Ace to use haha. Im still looking for the proper decals. I knwo archer and echelon have them… just gotta find them. I only carry archer. But dont have anything for Barkmann.
Echelon has Barkmanns decals and you can find them here
Thx for that link Lethal In fit of rage of having to pay full price I double checked my inventory here at work and realized we DO carry Echelon I was just had it mispelled 
Yay for 40% off.
Another quick question tho. Im using Osprey’s “Modeling The Panther Tank” as a reference and it mentions a Vallejo Model Air Panzer Green (096) as one of the colors. I carry Vallejo but not Vallejo maodel Air? Is there a difference? I mean I have a huge rack of vallejo paint and nothing that is panzer olive green?
James
There is a big difference - no matter how you thin it normal Vallejo is very runny if you airbrush it. It has absolutely no bite, which is great for figures but awful for airbrushing. Vallejo air is thinner, has more glycol in it, and dries to an annoying glossy finish. Besides the Vallejo German Armor colors being the worst set I have seen as far as color accuracy.
Personally I would go with Tamiya’s colors, German Grey XF-63 for Panzer Schwartzgrau 1939, Dark Yellow XF-60 for Panzer Dunkelgelb 1943, J.A. Green XF-13 or Field Grey XF-65 for Panzer Olivegrun 1943, Red Brown XF-64 for Panzer Schokoladenbrun 1943, and hull red XF-9 with a touch of German grey for red primer.
Yaaa I was planning on it… but the green highlights they suggested were that Vallejo color. Sooo yea I guess I should replace the vallejo green with the J.A. green…
thx hermes
Yeah, my usual highlight colors on those Tamiya colors are 60/40 Dark Yellow/White on Dark yellow, JA Green on Field gray, and 80/20 NATO brown/White on Red Brown. An alternate method is to paint the normal camo with Tamiya colors thinned with 25% rubbing alcohol, which will lighten the paint because of extra “flatness”, then do the lacquer overcoat which will somewhat darken it, and then highlight with the original colors. I did that on my King Tiger and it looked better than the usual method.
espins1 and Hermesminiatures, thanks for clearing up the Ace question I had! I may also do a Panzer IV for this GB if I can find enough info. Heck I might even do a Panther…I luv German armor!! This GB has already given me more knowledge & insight into the brave crews of the panzers.
Hermes, thanks for the heads up on Vallejo Model Air and your Tamiya color tips. I just bought a few bottles of VMA and was planning on using them on my King Tiger, but now I have doubts. The glossiness doesn’t bother me as much as the color accuracy you reported. Needless to say I will probably stick with tried & true Tamiya!
psychoblue23, do you work at a hobby store in Fremont, CA? If so, I think I may have met you during one of my visits there!
HobbyTownUSA in Fremont!
Yep, that’s the one! I haven’t stopped by there recently but I’ll try to soon. Other than a hobby store in Campbell your shop is the only one in the Bay Area that carries more than a few AM parts. I didn’t know you carried any Echelon decals for armor, but I did buy some nice Archer Fine Transfers for my Panther A. Keep up the good work there!
bufflehead, just to echo some of your sentiments, I’m really glad how this GB is coming together. This is exactly what I was hoping it would be. Thanks for everyone’s contributions so far. Don’t hesitate to ask for info or anything else you might need. I also encourage those of you doing research to add posts relating information about your particular ace and his exploits or any other information you have regarding the men and machines.
Great stuff guys! [8D] [:D]