Nope, the Apache community isn’t really using external aux tanks much anymore. With the internal Robbie tank in the ammo bay, it makes things a lot more weight & balance-friendly. We’ve got either a 100 gallon or a 130 gallon option, which pretty much covers anything we’d need on a mission.
Jon
Since '99, 4th Brigade in Katterbach, was doing alot of self deployments. Of course we carried ours outboard, but the Apaches carried one inboard, I think right side. I’m not sure if they still do it. I left in '03 and since they’ve been deploying more to the desert.
Supercobra, you’re right. Most of my familiarity is with the Army series. The Marines have used theirs much further into the abilities of the airframe IMHO. It’s outlasted the RAH-66 and who knows, maybe will provide the flyover when the -64 is put to pasture.
Chief Snake
Thanks for clearing that up Jon. I guess this is the JAH-1G although I can find very little info on it. I think these tests went in late 1978 just before the YAH-64 Hellfire firings. I would have sworn that was an LST vice designator. It looks very much like the ALT (AN/AAS-32) that briefly appeared on the doghouses of AH-1Fs. I’m with chief snake in that a designator wouldn’t do much good without a way to slave it (whereas an LST would still be useful) and I don’t see that happening in that configuration with the size of designators back then unless they moved the aircraft battery.
Ray,
If by six missiles you mean the tripple racks - no I don’t think Cobras (or Apaches for that matter) ever carried those operationally. I have flown with six missiles (three missiles each on four missile racks) - we left a spot open because you couldn’t carry a missile next to an aux tank.
Chief,
That could very well happen - it will be interesting to see which production line stays open longer - the AH-1Z or the AH-64D. With all of the Zs now being new build I guess you could say that the Cobra is newer then the Apache!
Hey, we get new Longbows too! (well, some of em at least!)
Randy, you’re probably right it was an LST. I’d been told it was a designator, but now that you mention it, it does look very much like the LST on the F model doghouse. In any case, here’s another pic of that bird in action, this time with what appears to be a standard M272 rack.
Oooh, look, we could start all sorts of speculation as to why the stabs are day glo orange!
Most likely to show up better on films made of the test firing
Ok guys, here’s one for you. It’s a RAAF OH-13 with a Mk-18 MOD 0 hand cranked Honeywell 40 mm grenade launcher mounted in the door. You can see the crew loading the 40mm ammo into the special ammo belt. I think this one is pretty cool.
Ray
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Here’s a pic of the Honeywell MK-18 on a tripod mount. the hand crank can just be seen on the right side.:
Jon,
Do you mind telling me what system is on this cobra? I thought it was kinda cool because you can see two AH-64’s (YAH-64?) in the background. Kinda strange seeing a cobra and an apache in the same pic don’t you think?
Ray
Ray,
Good eye on the YAH-64s! I believe that’s a SMASH Cobra, but I can’t really tell from that shot. The nose turret looks a bit small, but it definitely could be. No idea what the stuff on the wings is, though. Gonna have to look into this one!
Jon
Jon,
I thought it might be a SMASH cobra, but where is the AN/APQ-137 Target Indicator Radar? I suppose they could just be testing the FLIR. What time period do you think the photo represents? Also, do you have any idea of the time frame when SMASH was operational? Sorry, when it comes to Cobra’s I’m just full of questions!
Ray
Ray,
Without being able to see the -64s entirely, its hard to determine. Sometime around 1978 by my best estimation. The FLIR turret would make sense. They wouldn’t need the target acquisition radar at that point because they knew the Cobra wasn’t going to be fitted with a radar by that point. FLIR, on the other hand, is the essential core of the Apache program. Without FLIR, we’d be blind at night, which is something they were trying to improve on as fast as possible there.
Is this one of the archives photos? what’s the PN on it?
Jon
Jon,
I thought you might notice the PN when you saved the file. It’s 1843. Yes, it’s from the Archives. I should have cited the source in my initial post. There are a lot of AH-1 pics in that area of the Archive, but no more of that ship as far as I can tell. Wow, I guess it never dawned on me that the Apache is 30 years old! Thanks for the info.
Ray
Pretty amazing, ain’t it? The one’s I’m flying now are all around 17-20 years old.
I remember when the Army announced the Apache as the winner. Hard to believe it’s that old, but then the Huey is over 50 years old.
So, Jon, how do you like Arizona so far?
Ray, Jon
I believe that is not a SMASH Cobra in the picture. It’s an AH-1G with Airborne Target Acquisition Fire Control System (ATAFCS) mounted on the nose. ATAFCS was initially used in the podded version, but was later mounted on the nose of some AH-1Gs used in Hellfire/Apache programme. According to my references ATAFCS included stabilized day sight, FLIR and laser designator/range finder.
Hope this helps
Marko
Jon and Marko,
I found this on the Defense Technical Information Center web site.
“The AH-1G helicopter with the HELLFIRE modular Missile System (HMMS) and the Airborne Target Acquisition Fire Control System (ATAFCS) is being used as a surrogate trainer for the YAH-64 helicopter. The United States Army Aviation Engineering Flight Activity was tasked to provide quantitative and qualitative data on the handling qualities of the helicopter, obtain limited level flight performance data, and obtain limited handling qualities of the helicopter with only the ATAFCS installed. The test helicopter was a production AH-1G helicopter (212 tail rotor) modified with an ATAFCS mockup and carrying eight HELLFIRE missiles. Six productive flight test hours were flown in six flights. No shortcomings or deficiencies attributable to HMMS and ATAFCS installation were found. The AH-1G helicopter, with HMMS and ATAFCS installed, exhibits an additional equivalent flat plate area of 4.0 ft2 compared to the standard AH-1Q helicopter. The handling qualities of the helicopter with only the ATAFCS installed are essentially the same as the production AH-1G helicopter. (Author)”
The test took place at Edwrds AFB in California. Does the terrain in the photo look right for Edwards? I still don’t get what is up with the wierd Armamant racks. That’s not the standard setup for mounting hellfires is it? anyway, that was some quick research there, Marko. Certainly sounds plausable. The time frame for the above test (Jun 78-Jan 79) is also close to what you indicated, Jon.
Ray
Being born and raised in California and having covered just about every part of the state, either on business or pleasure, that is not Edwards.
IF it is even in California I would say it was carried out, where a lot of evaluation work was done with the Army, Fort Hunter Liggett. That is more like the terrain of that area.
While deer and hog hunting there one year we got to see, from a distance, this butt ugly airplane flying close support missions with the Army. I wish I had had a camera. That A-10 is still butt ugly but, AWESOME!!!
Randie,
Thanks for the info. There’s nothing like good intel!
Ray