After looking at Klaus Herold’s HS article on stressed skin…again… I am looking for a source of 3 view plans showing rivet patterns for different aircraft. Is there an online source or 1 big fat book that has many different a/c that shows that type of drawing?
If you have not seen the article,take a look HERE
Thanks in advance for any help.
Talk about rivet counting! I don’t know of any drawings like you mentioned, but you can assume that the rivets are spaced according to acceptable standards and practices (AC43.13)
The rivets will lie along the panel line, set back about 2 1/2 times the diameterof the rivet shank (for a 1/8th inch rivet, about 5/16 inch) and spaced along the line a minimum of 3 times the diameter.
I am not completely sure, but it looks like aircraft such as the B-17 and C-47 used a 3/16 round head rivet for skin attachment.
I have added rivit detail to all of my fw190’s, and also use almost the same method. I learned this years ago, so that idea is not new. The only guide I have is for an fw190, and it’s and old hasegawa kit with raised up rivit detail I use as a referance.
Hay Marc why dont you PM Klaus over at LSP and see what he can do for you.
FAR Part 43 (and CAA Manual 18 which preceded it) apply only to repairs to US Civil certified aircraft. What manufacturers do is probably going to conform generally to those documents but not necessarily, as the manufacturer has to conform to rules specific to the certification of the aircraft, CAA/FAA for civil and with the contracting military agency for military aircraft. These rules will vary from one country to another and from one military agency to another, so looking to a rule book is not too likely to help.
As usual in modelling, photographs are best, second best is an aircraft specific repair manual, such as the structural repair manual, but remember those manuals are for repair, not manufacture. They often do show original structure in some detail.
You really are working in an area where the art of modelling may be as important as the science.
wing nut this probably will not help, but here it goes. This is what I use a rivit guide for the fw190. It’s an old 70’s 1/32 hasegawa fw190 kit. since even the D series is really just an lenthened A-8 this should be reasonably accurate for most all 190’s. I was trying to find a good way to photograph it so the raised detail would show up. i ended up lightly sanding it and using an aquarium light for added help. If you think you can make this work let me know and I’ll photograph all the missing pieces and make it so you have a complete view of all the parts.
Upper right wing
lower right wing
tail section left side
mid fuselage sectoin left side
Front fuselage section left side
I used a sewing needle for tight places and pretty much the same procedure as the article you found. I can’t help you with other aircraft as the 190 is the only one I have done this to.
Well phoenix, since my attempt at this will in fact be a 190… yes i plan to build ANOTHER 190…so that will help a lot and have copy the pics to my PC Thnaks.
Rivet paterns are completly subjetive. When I was with Cessna in Wichita I spent some time in the factory. The major assemblies were (I hate to admit this) eyeballed. Granted they were within the proper spacing for the rivet dia. When I was at the service center I saw several a/c come in with “interestingly” shaped scab patches applied to the outside of the pressure vessel. I guess my advice here is do your best to guess the rivet paterns, however remember, aircraft are hand built unlike cars. That said there will be significant variations in rivet patern depending on the shift that assembled the a/c. Point being… don’t sweat it. On military a/c field expeidiency will always dictate the repair… JOSH
Allllllrighty then, I will take pics of the missing parts and get them up to you. I know you will need the center lower wing section, tail fins, gun hood, and upper front engine hood. Sorry it took so long I way trying to find a good way to get the rivits to show up in pics.
You and me seem to be building fw190’s faster then the germans did. How many of these thing are you looking at? I have 8 built, 5 in my collection. come on wing nut, you can beat that can’t you.
Marc, I picked up Kagero’s ‘FW 190 Volume III’ for my current F-8, and it comes with a pull out section with plans in 1/32 showing all the rivet lines. It also has similar plans within the book for 1/48, also including rivet plans.
I think Volume IV covers the long nosed 190s, and therefore should have a full rivet plan for these.
Worth looking at for any hardened Wurger lover.
Karl
Thanks very much Karl… that will be a big help.
As always, I do appreciate all the answer to this thread and once again I have learned something… that’s why I am here. But some sort of reference is needed to get started, even I was to sort of “wing it” as was suggested on another forum. Rivets attaches the skin to ribs and formers and these components position are determined by the plane in question. If I were to put that 190 wing pattern on a 109… well I can’t even imagine the hoopla that will ensue. [;)]
here are the missing pics
This is the center section between the wings.
Gun hood. not much there
tail like wings and fuselage same on both sides
and finally the lower fuselage. Someone had started to build this section. basically you have 4 evenly spaced rivit line getting closer as they get to where the tail section would be attached to the fuselage. Or on a D version where the extension plug would go. In 1/48 scale I do not add all the rivits just the ones that follow panel lines and near the cockpit. In 1/32 or 1/24 I add most or all of them. If you do it right you don’t really need to buff it out most of the time. I have gotten away with lightly sanding it with 2000 grit wet/dry sand paper and still get a good stressed skin look. hope you find this usefull