A few other recent discussions have prompted the following questions.
Do you belong to IPMS?
Do you build non-military figures?
If you belong to IPMS, what do you think your club attitude is toward non-military figures? If you don’t belong, what to you believe the local attitude would be?
Sean
hi i belong to ipms uk and now usa , but i can only speak for ipms uk , we have not problems with any figures of any shape or form , i do not build none military but i can see skill and art in all models cheers ian
Sean,
To answer your questions, I have been an IPMSUSA member since 1996. I build a little bit of everything which includes both military and non-military figures. At present I do not belong to an IPMS affiliated club; however, I do run a small club in Southwest Michigan. Members are encouraged to bring in their latest works, whatever they are, and share their experience with the group.
Without visisting your web link yet, I am assuming that you might be talkiing about female figures. I know that the IPMS has a particular stance on this issue that many do not care for. I can appreciate true craftsmanship whether it is on a tiger tank, an F-14, a Ferrari, a bust of General Patton, the creature from the black lagoon, or Bettie Page.
Until yesterday, I never really appreciated the IPMS view on female figures. I was at a local contest and there were two female figures entered in the non-military category. One was a nymph of some sort (green flesh tones and all) and the other was a female holding a hand warmer I believe with nothing else. The modeler did a fine job and it was suprising to see such a kit in the open like it was. Anyway, I overheard a female comment to her husband on her dislike of its presence. I guess in the end, it comes down to what do we need to expose our children to and at what age. There were several kids at the show and this was out for all to see. As my son is 13 now, the figure did not bother me, and it was reasonably well done. But the woman who was insulted had her point as well. I hope this helps.
Bull[:D]
Sean,
After visiting your web link, I see that I completely missed the mark in my first response.
Again, as the club that I run is small, I am the only one who builds creature figures. Although I haven’t done one in a while, they are a nice change of pace. When I have the creatures on display, I do receive a lot of positive comments on them.
Back to the contest I was at yesterday. It was an IPMS event (or at least it was sponsered by an IPMS chapter) and they did have a non-military figure category.
I know that most IPMS members are really into military equipment (mostly tanks and planes). Only a few then delve into the military figures and an even smaller percent attempt non-military creature and/or female figures. I hope this helps more than my first attempt at an answer.
Bull [8]
I dont belong to the IPMS club, though Ive been to a few meetings and I attend the big show when it comes to town. I seem to be one of very few who build the non military figfures around here, mostly female figures. The IPMS has “outlawed” figures showing any nudity of any kind at their shows and meetings, which I find unfair. If I was to enter a B-17 with nose art of a Vargas girl on it, “in the flesh” , it would be accepted and appreciated. But, if I was to build a model of that exact Vargas girl, in 3D, it would not be allowed.I understand parents wanting to “censor” their children from nudity , which, in some cases I agree, ie, Mascot , 3-D girls and the like models, which are pure sexual for the most part. But, what about the artistic style of some of the better tastful pieces. For example a JJ Figure model with a boob showing, or a Bettie Page model “Vargas Girl style”? Wat about the nude statues in museums ? They are considered “art” and are uncensored. Some are done very tasteful , and I feel should be allowed, even if they have to keep it off limits to children. Sorry for my rant, I just disagree when it comes to censory of this style of modeling.
, tim
Monster,
The last IPMS meeting I went to, one of the guys had a modern fighter jet that had a decal with some very explicit and racy art. The general comment from the “officers” was that it was a nice build but the plane would be excluded from the main room as a result of the decals. While I agree with you that we have become too sensitive they did discuss the option of creating an area in the main room that would be cordained off and not allow minors or the “more sensitive” to enter. This way those that wnated too could view and display things that might be deemed inappropriate for sensitive viewers. While I personaly dislike this type of thing (rating systems)and feel that there is nothing that cannot be solved by a good explanation from some responsible and open minded parents and participants, I do applaud the “problem solving” and willingness of the officers of the club to make sure that reality is not censored, just edited. It sthe best we can hope for I suppose.
Sort of ironic I suppose. An F-16 looks awsome and sleek. A tribute to engineering and design until you look at the damage it does and the human carnage it visits upon its opponents. I’m with you, how much longer before we can no longer display SS figure or vehicles because someones “sensibilities and delicate constitution are offended”? Don’t think it can happen? Wait…
Mike
An astute observation. I and my wife personally find nudity a lot less objectionable than violence. Especially in light of today’s standards for such things, the nose art of WWII is pretty mild. Many magazine covers today are a lot “hotter.” More to the point, if I build a model of a B-17, and put nudie nose art on it, what’s more objectionable: the nose art, or the fact that that plane (the real one, not the model) may have help raze a German city, killing thousands of innocent civilians?
I’m not arguing against building military models. I love to build 'em too. I just think a bit of perspective is helpful. What are we trying to represent? A killing machine, a piece of history, something to honor the sacrifices made by those who served? I seriously doubt that somebody builds a model plane and applies nudie nose art as some form of sexual gratification.
Again, you hit the nail on the head. I, personally, would much prefer to see nude females than SS troopers. But I wouldn’t presume to try to force a model club to hide those offensive figures and put out the much less objectionable nude women. [:D]
Regards,
-Drew
I was a member of the IPMS and quit after sixteen years because of the exact reason mentioned here. First they revoked club charters if all club members were not ipms members,then they started to require the removal of plex covers for judging. I do not like to spend hundreds of hours and a substantial amount of dollars to let my ship model uncovered. yes,I have had damage,that’s why I started making cases for my models. Now figures are under the gun! It never ceases to amaze me how a few cry-babies with an agenda can mess up things for the majority in this country. well, now I got that off my chest,happy modeling y’all.
In most of Europe you can’t display the Swastika on Luftwaffe kit box art, although they haven’t been banned from display models at shows from photos i’ve seen. I am a member of IPMS but not presently any of the local groups. I only model military subjects, but have no problem with tastefully done figures with some degree of nudity. That said, some of the figures from Mascot & others are blatently sexual if not down right pornographic. If someone wants to do this sort of thing, it’s his or her business, but I agree with IPMS banning them from display at public gatherings. Just my[2c].
Yes, I am an IPMS member and have been since the early 90’s. I am president of the local chapter. Couple corrections. IPMS/USA does NOT require 100% membership of a chapter to hold a charter. The rule is at least 5 members and all elected officers must hold national membership. A local chapter MAY adopt 100% membership and this is certainly encouraged but not mandatory.
Second, nudity, per se, is not banned form competition, even at the nationals, however, nude figures that are not specificially defined in Rule 5 are to be displayed in a limited access area. Certain depictions, such as the Mascot-type figures, excratory function and a couple others ARE specifically banned. I’m no prude, far form it, but the Mascot line is way over the edge of any type of good taste and really has no place in a public event.
Now to the point of the question: most contests do not break figures out by military or non military, though some do. The most common break down is by scale with mounted figures separate from free standing figures. Some events have a fantasy and/or sci-fi break out as well.
Alos, IPMS/USA is not a monolithic society. The national organization sets rules for the National event and those rules are being moved to the regional events in the future. Local clubs have a great deal of freedom and leeway to administer local events as they choose. As club president, I would exert a certain amount of discretion on monthly club displays as well. Models, whose description here would result in a warning form the moderators are not likely to be left on the table.
There has been and always will be some degree of controversy over nose art vs. 3D depiction of the same. Most events would acceed that if the aircraft in question had historically documented nose art it would stay. At my club’s local event, the head judge and contest staff would determine if a particular figure/model was inappropriate for display.
There is, after all, a difference between a Venus de Milo and a similar figure of Pam Anderson painted in full living color, possibly with strategically placed flocking., is there not?
Sean, Nice web site.
Here are the answers to your questions.
Al,
Well said. I think you cleared up many of the mis information from others post above. I personally have no problem with nudity in models. And keeping the more suggestive ones out of competition is ok for the reason rule 5 exists (previous bad press). IPMS is one of the better known model clubs and tries to be family oriented. In an effort to get more kids into the hobby IPMS is trying to be more family oriented. If it helps the hobby grow, then so be it.
There are also plenty of scenes that depict too much violence and those I can also do without.
Anyway, I always say build what you want. A good general club doesn’t care what you make. We can always learn new techniques, ideas from other modeling. Besides, it’s just a hobby. [soapbox]