From a previous thread asking about tank destroyers…
Yes Bill, your suspicions are confirmed. Work has commenced on the Dragon Sd.Kfz. 184 Ferdinand. I have meaning to snap a pic of the mail organizer i picked up cheap. It is great for keeping multiple sprues organized. If there are lots of sprues there is enough space, usually, to for 2 in each… AB, CD, EF etc.
The suspension requires a fair amount of prep to remove some minor flash and sprue gates that as thick as my arm. The top edge the faces up to the fenders, upside down in the pics, had a mold ridge like a mountain chain. My Exacto has a little bumper sticker on it now that says, “The knife has scaled Mt. McKinley”
Now for this last photo. I know the Germans are masters of engineering and workmanship yada, yada, yada. But i am guessing they are not getting these perfect welds on perfect channels with nice square edges around every armor plate. And they don’t have dead straight lines down the middle of the welds either. I may well be wrong about that so my question should be obvious. If not, should they be level with the surrounding surface and maybe sitting a bit proud/rounded?
As to your weld bead question, I have extensive experience in welding armor plate (M1 General Dynamics). Nowadays, the welding is all MiG wire, although applied by hand, the bevel or joints are large (1 inch to 3.5 inches.) Even though applied by hand, they look suprisingly good (in most cases). Vehicles with aluminum armor can be welded with robotic or “buggo” fixtures in which the welds are “perfect”. People assume that the full penetration ballistic welding would be robotic, but, it is still done by hand, due to many factors.
It would seem to me that these vehicles (Ferdies) were probably expedited in the production process to be ready for Citadel. However, even with a “stick” electrode, which was the technology in the 40’s, welding by hand, the welds were probably much beteer than late in the war. The key to weld appearance is the base metal, weld electrode, and the quality of thier respective chemistry. In late 42 and early 43, the Germans were producing armor steel with high quality (Panther, Tiger), as strategic bombing, etc., hadn’t had its full impact on the industrial base as it did in late 44.
In short, I would model these welds as close to “perfect” as I could get. I feel at this scale that you might be “stressing” a little too much about it. I tend to "overemphasize my applied weld beads because when the model is viewed with the eye, I want my effort to stand out and be noticed. The camera will emphasize the welds.
Guys like the Doog could care less about welds, and he (they) make some pretty good looking models. Keep that in mind when you are doing your weld work.
Crockett
Point taken on all accounts. There is no doubt that guys like doog and countless other are producing outstanding models with worrying about the welds. In the case of these particular welds, if I am correct about the appearance be off, i look at this as if it where some part the was round that was supposed to be slightly oval. If I can i would try to fix it. Or a T-34 with a perfect smooth turret and picture perfect welds. The turret needs some texture and the welds need… well… some texture too. When I built aircraft I was never a rivet counter. And I am not with armor either. Although it would be easier since there are fewer and the are really BIG. If I can make it look a little better I would like to. So I was just wondering of these where accurately represented.
I have this guy in the stash and am curious to see how you handle it, but don’t think you’ll have any problems with the PE and such. Fun camo’s abound.
Oh yes, I am familiar with your aircraft work as you know, I dabble with wingy thingies as well. I am sure, whatever you decide to do, it will be well executed. I have the white box “last production” kit of the Ferdie, the one that is in red primer with all the signitures on it. I have no interest in painting it this way, I will probably do a Kursk scheme on it.
Well, good luck on this baby, I’m sure you will nail it, as you always seem to do.
I’ll second the "great odea’ aspect ofthose sprue holders, Marc–you’re the “Idea man” here for sure! LOL!
NIce to see that your bogey are on correctly–when I built this kit I had a brain fart and put mine on all in the same direction! [sigh] I had to tear them off and do em all over!
Doog I wasn’t going to use zim on this one. From some of the reading I have been doing on the subject I got the impression that when the surviving Ferdinand’s were recalled for mods, these included a modified Stug copula, a few other goodies and zimmerit. once these changes were made they were called, for the balance of their service life, Elefants.
As far as getting the bogies right, I had practice… I built the Tiger (P) a while back[;)]
Marc–you got bad information. Zimmerit was PART OF THE UPGRADE.
If you want an accurate Elefant, you have to zimmerit it. I have the “History of the Schwere PzABT 653” and it covers that. It also has a ton of photos of Elefants in service, and I could not find ONE without zimmerit.
Sorry;; that’s porobably NOT what you wanted to hear…
I didn’t get the usual amount of bench time id normally do on weekends. had some dinner with friends then took advantage of the 45 degree weather. Built a nice big fire in the chimnea, a few glasses of Woodford Reserve bourbon, a fat cigar and a good friend… didn’t feel much like working yesterday. [xx(] I did manage some time in later in the day.
The inside of the wheel were painted before gluing together and everything was fitted on the chassis. Each track link had 4 ejector pin marks that had to be sanded off. That was glued up ala the doog’s toot. I glued the adjustable idle axle in place since 1 link either way is not going to be that big of a deal considered the varied amounts of sag i have noticed on the 1:1 vehicle. The guide horns are on every other link so there is the possibility, when making the adjustment, that there will be 2 similar links together. from what I have heard, on the 1:1 that may happen to and was OK as long as they where with the guide horns or else it may through track. Regardless, I made the connection at the idler sprocket so the mismatch is hidden. Now it sits curing with some weight on it to keep the track flat
After looking at dozens of photos, the welds do not look as deeply set as they are on the kit. A lot of these photos were of very dirty knocked out vehicles. If the were as deep as the kit dirt would have collected there and there should be a noticeable line like the one that would be on the model after a wash. This was not apparent so i am filling the welds to get them more or less even. I made the tool as seen in a toot on Armorama. The white welds are done with Apoxie Sculpt (AS) and the other are plain old Squadron green putty. Both work but the AS dose not stick as well as the putty when freshly mixed. The AS works better if you spread it in the weld and give it a chance to harden. That takes hours. The putty skins over quickly and can be worked with the tool very easily.
Hi Marc, while trawling this side I came accross your build. Very nice BTW so far. It was the weld bead questions that got me hunting in my photo album. Heres a Jagdtiger that is at a local tank museum. Its a pretty good pic of the glacis welds. Should be good info.
Nice progress so far. I’m starting my DML Elefant this afternoon. Still undecidded as to weather I am going to build it as the Ferdi or the Elefant. I just got everything I needed for my airbrush set up so this will be my first build with an airbrushed finish which I am looking forward to.
Can some one post a link to Doogs Majic Track tutorial? I searched but could not find it.
