That’s why I mentioned the Jag at the end! That’s the one the leggy blond really likes best!
Yeah, I guess Keilau has a point about the specifications. Any information that give the consumer a clue to what to expect is helpful, which is why I like to see “real world” numbers like 1/16" to 2" in preference to .5mm.
I’ll give the horse a chance to catch it’s breath now… [whstl]
Ninja ZX-14. $14,000
195.6 mph 0-60 in 2.5 seconds! Like having an Acme rocket between your legs!
As for the leggy blonds girlfriend, well lets say that when I was a bit younger and lived in Florida, My 600 ninja was very popular with Ms. Du Jour!
No fair bringing a motorcycle to a car fight!
My bike daze are long past (or is it that I’m long past my prime? No matter!) but the chicks used to dig my '76 Kawasaki 1000, done up as a cafe racer (3/4 fairing, flat bars, resets, full racing leathers) back in the day. Between that bike and my '67 'Cuda I was on first name basis with the local RCMP constabulary!
Sure didn’t go as fast at that Ninja. Don’t know if I ever want to go as fast as that Ninja without a couple more tires on the ground and a roll cage!
I’m in the same boat as The Count. Paasche VL or Iwata HP-CS. Why? Because Hobby Lobby is around the corner and they offer 40% off coupons. If we need a part, we can drive and get it. Now, sometimes the coupon is 30% off of Wilton Cake Decorating products. It would be during those times when ordering online and paying shipping would actually be faster, unless we didn’t care about paying full retail. The 40% coupon is about every-over week.
The Paasche VL lists for about $110 x 60% + 7% FL sales tax = $70.62
The Iwata HP-CS lists for about $179 x 60% + 7% FL sales tax = $114.92.
That’s a difference of $44.30 I could spend on kits and paint.
I will never spend the time needed to become a world-class IPMS champion. I will likely never purchase any photo-etched parts. I’ve no intention to build diaramas or cut-aways. I’ll be blessed if I will be able to successfully mask off a canopy.
The Iwata looks nice but I’m sure the Paasche will be good enough for me provided my Sprayit 600-13 compressor can push paint through it. And as I’ve never airbrushed before, I’ll probably be happy with whatever I use first.
There you go, then!
There is nothing wrong with the Paasche VL, it’s a fine airbrush and will serve you well. I have both a siphon and gravity fed and I prefer the gravity fed brush, but as you say, that’s another kit and a bunch of paint.
If you do buy an airbrush, what are you going to use as a source for air. That is actually a more important, and often more expensive, question as airbrushes are just straws that spit paint.
You are an engineer and that is why you want so much data on an airbrush.
I am a model builder with some art background with airbrushes and I have also done some machining in my younger days. Those specs don’t impress me and they have no bearing on the airbrushes performance and that is why I stress that point so much. It has become a selling point and I think it has misled many into buying an airbrush they did not need to spend so much on but they bought it because it had the smallest tip diameter.
So what? I bet they can’t paint any better than a guy with a far less expensive airbrush that doesn’t list the diameter of the tip or needle.
This is true, and the point I was poorly trying to make with the analogy to cars. Let me try again.
To an aficionado, the HP and torque ratings are important specifications, who wants them as bragging rights. Granny, who just wants a grocery getter, could care less what the HP is. She wants to know if she’s comfortable and safe. She’s going to be more interested in how many miles per gallon, and what her insurance is.
When I bought my last vehicle, I didn’t even look at the HP specs. Useless for what I was doing. I was buying a people carrier, and I wanted one that would carry my family in safety and comfort. I wanted to know I wasn’t going to spend most of my day at the gas pump, or being bent over the counter at the insurance agent. OMG I’M GRANNY! [:O]
And so it is with the average airbrush user. Details like taper length and needle diameter are basically meaningless without a reference point. Engineers LIVE for numbers, so those are important to you.
But if you’re going to ask for numbers, ask for what line widths the airbrush is capable of (which is different from what the airbrusher is capable of!), as that is a specification we all can use.
I see our horse has risen from the dead!! That just means more kicking [:D]
I could be wrong on this (or just mistaken), but on the other end of the spectrum doesn’t the needle size give some indication of maximum spray width? This was equally important to me in my recent airbrush hunting. A few forum-goers (I think Keilau included) recommended the H&S Evolution, which looks like a tremendous AB, but the 0.2 needle size had me concerned that I couldn’t use it for broader applications.
Yes Mucker that is a good question. The larger the size of the needle and tip the more paint it will put out!
I have posted in the past two of the airbrushes that I have found to put out the most paint and those were the Badger Crescendo and the Badger Anthem 155.
Needle size is an indicator of line width, but only because that also changes the taper. Neither as mere numbers are going to give novices any clue other than the smaller the size, the thinner the line.
Badger describes their needle sizes as Fine, Medium and Heavy, which tells the novice no more than a number would. However, they also give you this guide:
• Fine (F) - pencil line to 2" (51mm) spray pattern
• Medium (M) - 1/32" (0.8mm) to 2 1/2" (63mm) spray pattern
• Heavy (H) - 1/16" (1.5mm) to 3" (76mm) spray pattern
I have yet to see a corresponding guide from any other manufacturer.
As you can see, there isn’t a huge amount of difference at the narrow end of the spectrum (and how wide is a pencil line? Is that based on an freshly sharpened HB (#2 1/2) or what?), but a bit more at the wide end. And there is still no indication of how far away the needle is from the surface to achieve those sizes!
There are just too many variables to be precise in predicting the pattern without testing. The distance from the surface to the needle and air pressure makes as much or more difference than the needle size. Even the medium used and the the amount of thinner to paint can affect width.
The point is 99% of the time, it barely matters what the needle size or taper is. Very few modelers have the need for pencil thin lines, and most of us are spraying flood coats at around 1" - 2" is width, and all sizes of needles will do that.
Needle size is more an indicator of the difficulty spraying a relatively thick medium like model paint. Clogging tips becomes a greater issue, possibly requiring filtering the paint to remove lumps and a higher thinner to paint ratio, which can invite tip dry with acrylics.
I recommend medium sizes (.4 or .5mm) as being more useful to modelers OVERALL. I’ve not come across a need for smaller than 1/32" or wider than 2 1/2". I have two 100LGs, one Fine and one Medium, and it’s the Medium I use most. I also have a single action 200-20 with Medium and I can spray a thinner line with that than either 100LGs! Which is entirely due to my inability to use a dual action airbrush and hold a thin line consistently. [:$]
If you’ve already bought the Evolution with the .2mm nozzle/needle and are having troubles, you can buy the .4m nozzle/needle as parts. It just costs more to buy them separately than buying the 2 in 1 version.
That’s some great info, Bill. Definately a nice guideline from Badger…it gives a realistic expectation of the line size to the modeller. And you’re definately right…there isn’t a huge amount of difference between the three they show.
I wish I would have known that about the 0.2mm needle. If it could spray as wide as 2" it would be suitable…I probably would have bought the Evolution.
Clumsy me dropped my Iwata Evolution HP-CS and broke the threads on the needle chuck. I hemmed and hawed over the replacement parts (@$20 w/ shipping) or “upgrading” to a “better” airbrush. The HP-CS has been my workhorse for many years and I really like the versatility and ease of use/cleaning, but I had some issues with smaller German mottling.
I’m still working out the right formula of paint thickness, air pressure and distance. I fit in the description you made in an earlier post: the capabilities of the AB definately outrank the capabilities of the user!
My only use for “hairline” paintng is on some of the German mottling I’m challenging myself with. They sure had some cool camo schemes and I enjoy the challenge. I want to improve my AB skills.
I think most airbrushers try to find that “perfect airbrush” which can spray mico-thin lines and 12" wide blankets with the twist of a dial!
For me personally I’m trying to narrow down to my own Holy Grail that will accomplish my general work AND smaller detailed mottle on German aircraft. Right now I’m back and forth between my Iwata Evolution and the Sotar 20/20.
In Bill’s automotive terms, I’m more of a Ford-guy…[whstl]
Man, I had no idea you guys would be so passionate about this. All this information has been great to learn. Thanks guys.
[:D[ [:D[ [:D[