I wasn’t referring to just the previous post. You’ve offered many people detailed comparisons in terms of quality and capabilities between the omni and iwata without actually having them. You continually say that they are comparable in workmanship and design but you haven’t actually had them together to compare! If you actually put them together and compare, any claim of equal quality of workmanship cannot hold water. The Eclipse line costs a good chunk of $ more now but you do get a better constructed brush that can spray finer lines. I cannot debate that the omni is a fine brush, as it is clearly a fine brush and gives great results (better than most). If I had bought an omni first I may have never bought an iwata. But comparing the Iwata and omni side my side, the Iwata is clearly better. Most modellers don’t need a brush even as good as an omni. You and I are just at different degrees of overkill. I was just willing to spend the money to be pampered all the way.
Give me an example where I said they are comparable in workmanship and design?
Someone asked if the Iwata was better than the Omni and I said that it wasn’t.
How does that imply that they are equal in workmanship or design?
If you would read my previous posts you would see that I said to you on one occasion, “You are just used to the Iwata which is smoother and has tighter tolerances, but then again it costs about 33% more than the Omni so you would expect something for that much money.”
That sounds to me like I was saying the Iwata was a little better in terms of machining, but that the price was why.
I also said this: “let me say that I will be the first to say that “The Factory” in Japan does some very nice and precise machine work and builds the best machined airbrushes in the world except for the Sotar.”
Does that sound like I am saying the Omni is equal in terms of machining to the Iwata?
Maybe you should re-read my posts before chiding me for something I didn’t say.
But that is only something you have discovered true for yourself.
I know people who could spray as fine of a line with a Paasche VL as you could with that Eclipse so what does that say? Is it possible for a $59 VL to spray as fine of a line as a $105 Eclipse? In the right hands, yes.
Although I would agree that it would probably be easier for a beginner to get finer lines with the Eclipse as they are made to a tighter tolerance.
Mike
Dru reccomends the Custom Micron actually, he mentions it on his site in the classes section of it. I know they’ll all work, and I did eventually get a very nice cammo job with my CR, but the paint was too thick by that time [:)] I’ll do it again as well, and get it right the first time, now that I now how to do it. I just felt like a finer line brush could outline a bit better without quite so much overspray on the border. I do have good hands though, so I can get it down really well with practice. I’m interested to see how they compare to each other. I’ll probably be getting 4k or so back on taxes, so the bucks for the CM won’t be that big a deal really.
First though, I’ll probably pick up some art airbrushing paint, and give it a shot with some frisket, just to see how it comes out. I have an idea of making a knotwork with a dragon using metallic model enamels on paper. When the whole thing is painted, I’ll hit it with several coats of Future, then sand and polish it up with my micro mark polishing kit. I have a feeling it’ll be pretty cool, but all the frisket work might be a pain in the hiney.
Also, remember, we’re all friends here.
I agree.
My appologies to this group if my posts seemed out of line at all.
I in no way meant to be demeaning or imply that my opinions are the only valid ones out there. I appreciate all the input everyone gives here on what they have discovered with airbrushes because it gives us an accumulation of knowledge that is very helpful on this subject.
Mike
I, for one, am enjoying the discussion a lot. I always thought it was how the air brush laid paint down on a project that was important. I thought needle/nozzle combinations that work and if a needle/nozzle could be interchanged with another set might be more important. I didn’t know it was more important to worry about how much slack an air brush has or one air brush bowl is smoother than the other and takes 10 seonds less time to clean. I make sure I have ‘quiet time’, no distractions and I’m not in a hurry before I air brush so I make sure my air brushes feel right and I’m not in a hurry to clean them.
I’m not trying to be sarcastic but have the two of you thought about trading ABs and doing three projects to get familiar with the other ones brush? Then see if it is enlightening to see the other’s point of view?
Carry on!
No, nobody was out of line or even getting testy at all, but I’ve seen this kind of thing get out of hand and personal on other forums. I didn’t feel that anyone was demeaning or anything like that. I enjoy everyone’s input and hate to see things get blown out of proportion due to the limits of text communication.
How is that comparison coming along by the way Karl?
I was just reading along with all the informative posts. I don’t think anybody thought you were out of line. But the strong arguements both ways helped to point out issues that someone like me might get something out of.
I’ve been shooting an Aztek 470 for awhile now and I think I’ve outgrown it. I find myself wanting more out of an airbrush. This thread has helped a lot.
I"m considering either the Iwata HP-CS or the Omni 4000. And I can use the Aztek for some general purpose stuff.
But this brings up a question. Do people use the HP-CS and 4000 for the finer lines (.35?) and a second airbrush for cases when they need more coverage (.5?)… say your airbrushing larger with a base coat. Or are these airbrushes flexible enough that you can get by with just the 1 airbrush?
Well, my Revolution has only a .5 nozzle,and I did manage to get a nice looking cammo job on a 1/72 spitfire with it. It took me a bit of practice, but I did get it. I’m interested to try an omni or an Eclipse CS just to see how they compare to my CR, but I don’t really need any more of a brush than I have already. Want is a different thing though. I want to start doing some airbrush illustration though, and that is a different animal entirely.
No, either one of the models you mentioned will spray both fine lines and heavier lines.
The siphon-fed Omni 3000, and later the Eclipse BCS, were both designed for T-shirt airbrushing which requires a lot of paint to cover backgrounds, etc.
The Omni 4000 and Eclipse CS models are gravity-fed decendants of those siphon-fed models and spray very similar.
Now bear in mind that they will not put out the paint that an airbrush with a #5 needle and tip will, but most people never need that much paint unless you are painting something big like a 1/48 B-1 or something that needs some real coverage. [:D]
In the case of models that big it might be better to just drag out the automotive spray gun for those monsters. [(-D][(-D]
Mike
Thanks for the reply. And I see your points. I’ve only had it happen once or twice where I was airbrushing something that took a lot of coverage and about half way thru I was ready to kick myself for tryin to do it [:p] But like you said… that only happens once in awhile.
I’ll probably pick up one of these airbrushes and try it out on a 1/16 tank I’m working on. That should be a good test for coverage [;)]
I found that with double action experience the HP-CS and omni sprayed very well on first try. I would say that your revolution probably is the only brush you’ll ever need.
I got way out of hand buying and comparing. I could actually be fairly happy with my aztek. The results I got with it were very good. I’m just too picky and I was obsessed with getting the finest soft edges I could get without having to mask.
I just feel that the Iwata finally set me free to enjoy painting without any frustration that are normally associated.
As for my comparisson, I’ve been sidetracked by my girlfriend, work and an F-14B low-vis scheme. I just got excited about how it was coming out and had to keep working.
The Revolution will do fine for models, I have no doubts about that, but I do intend to get one for illustration, where I can see that it would make a big difference. I’ll know for sure what kind of difference it will make pretty soon, as I’m going to start painting a new knotwork in a day or two. I’m going to mask a lot of it with frisket, but some is simply going to have to be done freehand. That’s when I’ll see the difference a fine line would make. If I’m totally happy with that, I have another project in mind, almost entirely freehand, and if I’m happy with that, I won’t get another brush for illustration with after all. (I do want to get a new brush though, just to see 
I do need a new compressor however. The “blue ice” diaphram I bought some time ago isn’t quite cutting it. It’s loud and it pulses and gets hot. Anyone have any reccomendations for a decent tank compressor that is quiet enough to have running in the same room? My hearing is bad enough as it is. [:)]
Josh,
What are you looking for and how much are you willing to spend?
There are many good models from Badger, Silentaire, Iwata and others.
Ask the dentist where you work to let you have his and he can buy a new one. [(-D]
Mike
I work at a lab that’s an independant business and we work for several dentists around town. In fact, in about 4 more years, I’ll be half owner of the business, one of my bosses is going to retire and I get to buy in. We acutally have a great great compressor there, but it’s somewhat loud. It’s a great big JunAire model, we run it at 80 or more psi all day every day and it’s never had a problem at all. I asked how much they paid for it, they said about 3k to 5k (I don’t remember exactly). I’d love to have one like it when I get a house though, air tools, filling tires, blasting dust out of the computer and Playstation, ooh the possiblities!!
I’ll be looking to spend a few hundred dollars, less than 300 hopefully. I want a quiet one with a tank, so I don’t have noise and pulsation. I’m not particular as to oil or oil less, is there a huge difference, should I opt for one over the other? I don’t have much compressor experience.
So given those constraints, anyone have any compressor suggestions?
hey madda, ill build you a silent one for $299.99 and ship it for free.[:D] i doubt very seriously the frig compressor could keep up with an air tool. sears has some decent deals on upright tanks on wheels that im thinkin of buyin for my “big airbrush”(cup gun) to finish cabinets with. the one i was lookin at was a 20 gallon with upright for about $345. im sure its kinda loud though. later.
Josh,
I have a Jun-Air 6-Maxi which is the oil lubricated model. It is about 35 dB in volume and doesn’t vibrate hardly at all. They are, of course quite expensive new and that is why I bought mine used.
If this is going to be for modeling only then I would consider the following:
This is the new Silentaire Scorpion II with tank. It sells for $299 at Dixie Art.
This is the Createx Stealth 5000 and it sells for $299 also from Dixie Art.
These are about the only good units out there with a tank for less than $400.
I think the Silentaire Scorpion II would be my choice out of the two as it is quieter. These are both oiless models by the way. The models that use oil tend to have a longer life but there are none out there that I know of for less than $400 as I said.
Mike
dont be stealing my glory mike![(-D]