I’m in the same boat as Hammer and agree with him.
The smell is good also![;)]
As Ross has posted over and over, you better get used to acrylics as enamels are on the way out.
I’m using the Tamiya paint on a 1/48 Storch right now, and I decided that there were some panels that were going to be easier dealt with off the airframe & brush-painted. Sooo, I tried this: primer first, then two or three coats of acrylics heavily thinned, “airbrush thin”, and they covered pretty well, didn’t dry too fast etc. Until my LHS gets some of Tamiya’s paint retarder in I’ll keep using this method. It menas a few extra painting sessions along the way, but the stuff does clean up easily.
Mike, I know you and Ross have both said it, but seriously, the main lines of Enamels here, Testors and Humbrol, do not appear to be going anywhere. They are always well stocked at the LHS and neither company has put out messages saying that those lines are being discontinued. Even overseas, Revell, WEM, and XtraColour appear to be doing well, and those lines (as well as Humbrol) are from countries where the “greens” hold far more control over laws than here. I think the only thing we really see is that Acrylics are for more widespread than they used to be. It’s just a thought, but I believe that the few other lines of enamels that have disappeared (Pactra, Floquil) have been due to the fact that Testors bought them out and eventually dropped them (hmmm, corporate raiders? [prte]) rather than any environmental or other reasons. Just look at now Polly Scale is being discontinued- Testors buys them up, raises the prices to be roughly 25%-33% more than “their” own acrylic line, then discontinues the line due to “poor sales”.
If the day comes where enamels are truly and seriously gonna go away, I will get a paint stash going too![proplr] I do doubt it will be in the near future.
I have only echoed what Ross has stated as he is the expert on paints and where they are going as far as toxicity and so forth are concerned. I stopped using enamels several years ago and see no reason to go back to them. Using lacquer thinner to clean my airbrush is not something I prefer to do as that stuff is noxious and is much more flammable and dangerous than any cleaner for acrylics. People just need to roll with the times and adapt to other paints if need be as it is not that difficult. I have probably sprayed more acrylics in my life through an airbrush than 95% of the people on this forum and they really are not that bad.
I dont own any lacquer thinner and have not ever used it to clean my airbrush. Plain old hardware store paint thinner and nylon brushes have sufficed to clean out enamels, and I have tried various things to clean out acrylics (windex, simple green, testors acrylic cleaner) along with those same brushes or pipe cleaners. As far as “rolling with the times”, no thanks, not my style (Levi 501s and a flat top never go out of style [;)]). As long as the things I prefer are available I will buy them. If the enamel lines are shut down (highly unlikely in my view)-other folks use them besides us model builders, just look at spray cans, nail enamels, auto touch up paints, etc… I will go 100% acrylic by force, as need be.
To clarify (once again):
My contacts in the coatings industry have told me that within the foreseeable future (5 to 10 years) enamels will be gone except for specialty coatings. This is due to the concerns with toxicity and the environment. Exactly when it occurs is the question (probably sooner in places like California, where everything is known to cause cancer or otherwise be hazardous to your health [8-)]). But it is coming. What governs the speed with which it comes are the rapidity with which adequate substitutes for them are developed, the amount of resistance from the chemical supply industry, the amount of health and environmental fervor (currently low, as always during a depression), and how much the politicians feel the need to appear to be doing something besides lining their, and their friends, pockets. I suspect one of the big factors pushing this is oil, or the perceived lack thereof.
There is also a possibility that enamel “hobby paints” and oil “artist’s paints” may survive as “specialty coatings.” That, in some ways, would be worse. Anything with “special” associated with it is spelled $$$$pecial, as in $$$$pecial price.[:@]
As most of you methane breathers don’t seem to realize, I’ll be sad to see them go. As of now, no brushable metallic acrylic paint is worth the polymers it’s printed on, at least that I’ve found. (Haven’t tried Vallejo, yet.) Airbrushable metallics have been saved by Hawkeye’s Talon acrylics, which are superior paints, IMHO.
So stop giving me grief. You been warned, pilgrim. Forewarned is forearmed…(wait a minute, we all have fore arms…maybe it’s supposed to be four armed… [:P])
Fair enough! [;)] And I do not mean to come across as giving grief. I am more of wait and see if and when it really happens mindset. Out here in Cali as you noted, we can barely sneeze without it being thought a new protective law is needed for our own safety, but modelwise things are still good! Several great well stocked hobby shops within a short driving distance and IPMS and AMPS chapters to share your work in person and meet fellow modelers. As bad as things are in some respects, this is one area where life is really good right now.[bgr]
And to lay yet another ridiculous card on the table, there are more than one way to thwart the access to materials being used to make enamel paints. If the EPA can’t stop them, then the Department of Homeland Security will. One of my suppliers sent me a form to fill out at the bequest of the DHS to verify I am not a terrorist making volatile chemicals for evil purposes. Homeland Security is slowing lowering the bar on what are considered excessive quantities. Pretty soon you’ll have to have a special permit or license to purchase thinners and solvents. Don’t be surprised if you don’t have to show an approved form of gov’t ID to purchase a quart of paint thinner.
The current administration is closing the gaps between agencies. Think about it. Now with this soon to be passed bill, the IRS will now be in the health care industry as their thugs hired to verify compliance and collection. Think about how they will go about facilitating the control of hobby related chemicals…I’m from the FBI and you’re in violation of the domestic chemicals act of 2011. I’m afraid I’ll have to have those model paints.
Better stock up on Vasoline, you’re gonna need it and that too will be regulated as they know it eases the effect of them…you know.
Hans von Hammer…Do you (or anyone else) happen to remember when those Testors bottles were $0.49? Just curious and interested.
I use enamels, acrylics, oils, craft paint, house paint, inks, lacquers and even wifeys nail polish once in a while.
Static,some of us “older” modelers remember when the price “jumped UP” to 49 cents,I think there was a 9 cent bottle at one time, not sure,but, I do know there were 15 and 19 cent bottles when I was a kid back in the sixties,with a cap that was about 2/3 the diameter of the current cap
side note about Talon paints,Hawkeye, you just HAVE to mention the difference in the smell in your adds, or on your site, or something
I “had to” switch to Acrylics (the Lady is allergic to enamels), just recently,got my Talon order, and when I opened up the first color my thought was,Man, this is sure better than the Floquil Old Silver I used to use (remember the old Diosol to thin it with?)
Now, I sit and paint bomb and missile stripes next to the Lady while watching a movie,sure couldn’t do that before
one other advantage, at least with PolyScale,is that the color doesn’t vary between brushing and spraying,maybe because it doesn’t take as much thinner to airbrush as Model Master did
Thanks TarnShip. I’m no spring chicken but didn’t model as a kid. Took it up in the 90’s.
well, you picked a good time to “jump into” this
we argue, gripe and discuss,but,there are many, many more options out there in every aspect of the hobby now
just your question about paints,what? 15 lines of paint all told now?,that used to be done with Railroad paints and color mixes on index cards,now, name your specific color, someone makes it if you are open minded about the medium
fun topic to read
Rex
I remember when I bought my first FSM magazine on a lark back in 1992…I couldn’t believe all the tools and “stuff” that was available just to put a “plastic toy” together. That is when I started to model…been totally addicted ever since!!
$0.49? Hell, I was buying them when they were $0.19 and the price was printed on the cap… Practa 'Namel & Testor’s were the same price, but it seemed that Practa had the first boxed “Military Colors” set, IIRC…
yup, Pactra Authentics in those plastic bottles,take pliers to a stuck cap,and booom,plastic and paint all over the garage bench, they filled the gap until importers started bringing in Humbrol,they also came in boxed sets back then
Hand and TarnShip…you guys probably have me by age, but I’m old enough to remember the Pactra enamel bottles. We used to paint our Matchbox cars with these.
I really miss soe of those Pactra colors. They had the BEST dark OD shade out there…and Khaki. It compared perfectly with my days old Khaki uniforms.
When I first started buying paints (roughly 1984), Testors were 25 cents a piece at the Ft. Leavenworth PX. By the time we moved in 89 they were up around 85 cents. When we got to Hawaii (also 89), they were $1.15. That’s about the time I stopped building for a couple few years.
So from what I have gathered (Im new to this btw) is the acrylics came about as a more “less-toxic” paint?
Are there are durability issues? Will Acrylics chip off for instance? What is I paint something (plastic model) that would need to be washed or cleaned with a damp rag every so often?
I am planning to build static models, but also to paint slot car bodies (hard plastic just like a model) and alum. slot car wheels. With the bodies, they will dirty from being raced and dusty and maybe get a little oil on them from being handled at the race track. So I would then take the body off the car and wash it with water and soap or clean it with a damp towel. The alum wheels, come in silver and sometimes to make the model more “scale like” I would want to paint them black of white etc. I would like a paint that would stick.
At my LHS today, someone mentioned that Tamiya makes a primer for metal??
Well please recommend based on my use.