72 scale submarine details

Friends, I make no claim of expertise, but want to share some observations.

I started drilling out the deck holes on my new Gato boat and looked closely at the deck details. There are two items that aren’t mentioned in the instructions; the oval raised section and the key shaped recessed detail. The oval shape looks very much like the emergency marker buoy installation on the post-war USS Cod. I haven’t found a single picture that shows this shape installation on a wartime boat. Curiously, the key shape appears both fore and aft in the same postwar Cod pictures, but again, I haven’t seen it in any wartime photos. Does anybody know what this detail represents?

Back to the emergency marker buoy, and the foredeck companionway. In the pictures I’ve looked at the position of these details appear to indicate the plans to which the boat was built. On Government boats (Portsmouth plans, also used at Mare Island) the companionway is on the port side of the centerline just aft of the hatch, and the marker buoy is forward of the hatch on the same side. On commercial boats (Electric Boat plans, also used at Manitowoc), the companionway is on the starboard side of the deck, with the marker buoy on the opposite side, both just aft of the hatch. On some boats the marker buoy appears to be covered by a section of deck plate, but on most it can be seen clearly in it’s well.

Does anybody have any information on the location of the flood holes in the bottom of the ballast tanks? I saw a single reference that said they were “rectangular in shape”, but where, how many, and how oriented, I wonder. The same vents in the bottom of the Type VII U-Boats are very well detailed on the 72nd scale kits of those boats, but not on the Gato. Anyone?

Just wanted to share. Thanks.

PS: I have some illustrations. Can someone tell me how to post pictures, please?

Please check this thread for answers to your question, above:

http://s181686668.onlinehome.us/phpBB2/messageboards.php5

Thanks! I found it. Too cool.

You’re right o targaet in all your obersvations. basically, tho it’s a good model, the Revell kit is of the post-war Cobia, because that’s what they studied to make her.

Marker Buoy should be- like in war pix - a large round manhole covere with at least 4 circles of holes like the deck, and not sure what’s in the ctr, the drawings indicate to large circles of something and the photos are unclear. The rectangle with oval ends marker is very post war.

And the diff yard boats have the diff companionway, as you say, EB = PORT buoy and STB companionway, and Portsmouth PORT buoy (further fwd).

Drilling out - I would also suggest using a ballcutter or similar ina dremel and drill out a bit form underneath, so that the holes give the illusion of being in thin metal. It might not make a difference, but the technique works well with big holes, like the vents in the VIIC uboat - I thinned the edges of mine to give illusion of scale thin.

The cross/keyhole you mention - a mystery, tho it is definitely a ost war add-on. If it were me, I’d go with some of the good photos out there and ignore the modern.

I am researching to release a metal deck replacement in Photo Etch, but I’m not sure how that project will go. In some ways Revell seems to have gotten it wrong, but overall, it’s pretty good. There were so many variations.

That link to Fleet Drydock of the Sub Committee has the flood hole info, and it is a good resource in general for the Gato. I have also started a forum just for this model, about a year ago, over at:

http://p104.ezboard.com/brevellgatosub

Please keep us all posted on yoru reseach, thoughts, and progress!

Not sure how to post images on this forum, the FAQ wasn’t all that helpful. If you head over to modelshipwrights, they have a gallery section, both for general and your own…

http://www.modelshipwrights.com/

Hope this helps, keep up the goo work

This is an outstanding site for us U-boat builders, thanks!

Scott

Torpedo tubes…

Based on the pictures I’ve seen, the uncovered aft torpedo tubes depicted in the Revell boat are typical of commercial boats. The government boats all had aft torpedo tube outer doors (see the USS Pampanito in drydock photos). I hoped perhaps the government would have given them up somewhere along the production run, but I observed them on early Gato boats and late Balao boats as well, so I guess we’re stuck with them if we want a government boat. They’re well illustrated in a couple of pictures, but terrifically complex curves, and all four are unique. I’m thinking bondo and sandpaper.

Question: I see two distinct types of forward doors, the graceful curved doors in the kit and another, more angular type (again, look at the Pampanito). These don’t seem to be specific to builder, has anyone any information on when they were introduced and where, why, on what boats, etc?

Thanks.

OK. First of all, what you’re calling Torpedo tube doors are called shutters. The outer doors cap the ends of the torpedo tubes.

The scalloped shutters were carried over from earlier Fleet Subs (Perch, Tambor, etc.). Gatos and some Balaos had them other Balaos, and the Tench boats had the squared end shutters. Also the same style shutters were used fore and aft. If anyone wants pictures, drop me a line at mkeatingss@cox.net .

As for the shutters on the after tubes, many skippers kept them but others didn’t. And after the war many boats lost them. But, again not all. I remember seeing Boats, with after shutters, as late as 63-64, on the Guppys.

Lastly as to which boats had which shutters. If it’s a Gato, the scalloped shutters are correct. If it’s a Tench, the squared end shutters. If you want a Balao, check what pictures you can find and hope for the best. If you’re going nuts, and want a Guppy, use the squared end shutters. Although, if you ARE building a Guppy, that’s the least of your worries.

Mike K.

Right, shutters, I knew that, I lost my mind, just for a minute.

Let’s see if I understand what you said. There were generally two styles of shutters, the scolloped type (as on the Revell boat) and the angular type (as on the Pompanito) The shutters are the same between builders, but changed sometime during the Balao production run. Some skippers had the aft shutters removed during refit, just like they would move the deck gun or TBTs to suit their preference. Is this right?

I’m afraid I’m still a little confused (not your fault, obviously). I found pictures of two Electric Boats on Navsource, Bonefish and Paddle, that appear to show them built without aft shutters at all. And another Electric Boat, Grouper with the aft shutters. As I look at the pictures, if you remove the shutters from the Grouper, the resulting hull penetrations won’t look at all like the aft end of the other boats. Wierd. There’s a good picture of the Gato, another Electric Boat, but it’s pretty much in shadow, so it could or could not be the same as the Grouper.

USS Bonefish (SS-223) http://www.navsource.org/archives/08/0822309.jpg

USS Paddle (SS-263) http://www.navsource.org/archives/08/0826302.jpg

USS Grouper (SS-214) http://www.navsource.org/archives/08/0821410.jpg

USS Gato (SS-212) http://www.navsource.org/archives/08/0821242.jpg

There’s an excellent photo of the Wahoo which clearly shows her after shutters, and they don’t look at all like those on the Electric Boats. I’m so depressed.

USS Wahoo (SS-238) http://www.navsource.org/archives/08/0823816.jpg